Ferguson's theory about never entering a pot without raising

[betgo]

Ferguson's article on bet sizing in the "Full Tilt Strategy Guide" is interesting. I don't agree with his points about not letting your hand influence your preflop raise size or flop bet size. I think it should be a factor, but not in an obvious way.

Ferguson does not believe in open limping, which I of course do not agree with. He also says that when he won the WSOP ME he used the approach of never entering a pot without a raise. That is, if there were limpers, he would raise. If there was a raise, he would reraise. If it was reraised, he would 4-bet if he played. He says that is how he played then, but he doesn't play that way entirely now. He said it helped him win the WSOP, because people overestimated his hands when he reraised.

First of all, this depends on personal style, and someone like Negreanu, who likes to outplay postflop, is not a big reraiser.

Also, you have to take into account the nature of your hand, your position, the action, the stacks, and so on. Sometimes a flat call or limp behind is better.

A raise or reraise also reopens action for a limpreraise or 4-bet, so there are advantages to not raising.

However, I think there is a lot of point to what Ferguson is saying. People will flat call or limp behind and see a flop taking the "safe route", when a raise puts more pressure on.

Obviously, "resteals" have become common for short stacks late in tournaments.

I think that with deeper money, often times a reraise is more effective. People have the attitude that a reraise needs to be a very strong hand, but this is not true. I realize also that loose reraises are common in major tournaments and other relatively tough tournament tables.

[curtains]

The key is that he doesn't play that way now [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] I assume that is pretty much an admittance that his old strategy was not ideal.

[Colombo]

Open limping is gross.

Ferguson's theory makes more sense as the blinds get deeper and stacks shallower. However in the first level 3betting with a hand like 33 is just dumb.

[curtains]

Ehh Open limping is obviously fine in plenty of situations.

[Colombo]

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Ehh Open limping is obviously fine in plenty of situations.

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I could see open limping being ok with like QJs or 44 EP in the first level, but I'd still prefer to raise.

Where else do you think open limping is fine? IMO, a raise is always more profitable.

[curtains]

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Ehh Open limping is obviously fine in plenty of situations.

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I could see open limping being ok with like QJs or 44 EP in the first level, but I'd still prefer to raise.

Where else do you think open limping is fine? IMO, a raise is always more profitable.

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There are very few absolutes in poker. There are so many different game conditions and opponents that it's usually incorrect to say one thing is always correct 100% of the time. I can imagine open limping in many situations. I of course open raise more often, but most of the best players in the world open limp on occasion. I actually dare you to name one top player that you've never once seen open limp on TV (not counting the SB of course).

[shaundeeb]

Open limping is the right move in such a resteal happy world.

[nairb09]

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Open limping is the right move in such a resteal happy world.

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[betgo]

There are obviously situations where flat calling is best. However, my observation is that people these days tend to reraise with shallow money, but with deep money, there tends to be a call and see the flop approach. Often a reraise is a better play. That is what I found interesting about Ferguson's approach.

Obviously, there are some situations where open limping is reasonable. For one thing, it sets up a reraise.

I also think people limp behind when a raise is better, but obviously if you have 33 on the button, limping behind is generally better.

I thought Ferguson had some good ideas but they were expressed in too absolute a way. For example, he says don't vary your raise by your hand, and gives the example of if you only sometimes limp AA, but limp nothing else, or sometimes make an extra large raise with AA but do that with nothing else, then you give away your hand. Well, some people do give away AA or KK by makig unusual plays.

However, Brunson is Super System suggested limping big pairs and suited connectors in the same situation. Harrington suggested making a large raise with AK or TT but varying the raise size and sometimes making the large raise with other hands. It seems like you can vary your raise by your hand without giving away too much information.

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Open limping is the right move in such a resteal happy world.

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Don't resteals entail a steal attempt, not an open-limp?