UK Trip Report

[yanfu]

I was in London for a business trip and decided to play some poker at the Grosvenor Victoria Casino "The Vic" near central London.

The casino was pretty nice, when I first arrived, I had to show my passport and register as a member(which was free) and get a members card. It took about 5 minutes and then I was given a tour by the hostess who showed the casino and gave me a free drink at the bar, which was kinda cool. The hostess said "you are a poker player?", I wondered why, then I realized that there was noone under 50 playing any of the table games or slots.

The poker room was upstairs next to a restaurant and had about 20 tables, some standard poker tables and some round tables like you might see for sale in sports store or home game -- more on the round tables later.

All the games play using Pounds, 1 Pound = 2 US Dollars, they had a currency exchange window in the casino and the rate was really good, no fee for exchanging either. They also had ATMs with no fee, but your bank may charge a fee for international withdrawls.

All games had an hourly time charge that ranged from 4 to 10 pounds that they collected at the tables. No rake at the tables and, from what I could tell, no dealer tipping, because I never saw someone tip the dealer. I never tipped the dealer, but of course, I never won a pot either [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

On to the action (all figures in Pounds)...

There was a tourney going on 300 + 20 buy in, which was using most of the tables, there was however a 1/2 and 3/3, 100 min - no max PL Holdem game going, none of the pot limit games had a max buy in! Also a .5/1 25-100 buy in, 1/2 50-200, 1/3 100-300 NL Hold-em games going. They didn't spread Limit games.

After about 20 mins, I was seated at the 3/3 Pot-Limit game, bought in for 150 didn't have to post and for my first hand was dealt TdTh in MP2. I opened for the pot making it 12 to go. The button and BB called. The flop was 9h 6h 4s. I bet 30 and was called by the button, BB folded. The turn was the 7h and I bet pot ~90, was raised and called for about 25. The river was an offsuit K and he had JJ.

I re-bought and played longer, play was fairly tight and pretty good, some players were predictable, but others were good. I picked up some small pots and was called for my Omaha game.

The PL Omaha had a 1 Pound ante, then when you were dealt your hole cards it was 3 pounds to go, no blinds, but a button moves around the table for betting position. Very odd structure and it took me awhile to get used to it. Kind forces you to play more hands than you would in a typical blind structure. I initially bought in for 150, but once I got my bearings, upped it to 500, the rest of the table was pretty deep. It seemed like people were playing pretty tight and I picked up some pots on ragged flops that no-one wanted, then went card-dead for an hour. Then an older asian guy sits to my left and open raises pot for his first hand, bets the flop w/ one caller, check calls the turn and river and shows down a ragged Jh 2h 5c Ts hand for the rivered trip 5s. He seems pretty bad in general and I wish I was on his left.

I limp w/ As 8h 9s Th in MP and he raises to 10, I call with two others. Flop is 7h Jd 9h, I check he bets 25 and I raise the pot. He calls and has about 20 chips left. Turn is Kh and I put him all in. He calls and the river is a 5h, I show my hand and he almost mucks but turns his hand over hand has the Jh 2h 2s Kd for the better flush.

A few hands later I open raise from the CO with 6s 7h 8s 9d, he calls and so does an early limper. The flop is 4s 7c 8d and I bet the pot. He calls and the limper folds. Turn is the 3d and I bet the pot and he calls. I check river and he bets 20, which I call and he shows Tc Jc Qc As.

I go card dead for about 2 hours then decided to switch to NL hold-em.

I sat in a 1/2 200 Max, 100min NL game at one of the smaller round tables, where I learned what these are for: There is no dealer. The players deal the hands and deal rotates around player to player. At first I thought this would suck, but it was actually really fun and had more of a home game feel but w/ some of the guidance of the casino. The game is definitely slowed down by deal, but not unbearably slow. Mistakes are generally arbitrated by the player but the floor can be called to make decisions. It's a cool novelty. The NL Hold-em games were juicy, wide variety of players a lot of whom were very basic. Games played very passive, typcially, players would min raise and reraise pre flop or maybe triple the blind. A typical hand went like this: BB is 2 pounds, Aggressive Aussie raises to 4, his buddy raises to 6, a caller or two and the rest fold, original raiser calls. Flop comes, original better bets 2, his buddy raises 2, others fold. Turn, orignal better bets 5, buddy calls. River, he checks his buddy bets 5, he calls, middle pair good. While they did spread NL games w/ a dealer, I opted to stay at this table for the rest of the night because the game was so good and the table charge was only 4 Pounds an hour, and it was really fun.

Some of the regulars learned to really angle shoot these games and call people out selectively on string raises, missed burn cards or betting out of turn. Most players deal so poorly that you can almost always "know" where 1 or 2 cards in the deck are per deal. It's a fun novelty and in these games you certainly don't have to tip a dealer. But the cool thing is, most money stays on the table since there is no rake and only 4 pounds per hour in time charge, money doesn't quickly bleed off the tables like in most US casinos.

Play was really bad. I just value betted the hell out of any decent hand and usually got paid off. People were easily scared off by standard 1/2 - 3/4 size bets.

The very last hand of the night I looked down at pocket kings, everyone was ready to gamble because the place was closing, guy makes it 15, huge raise for this game, I make it 30 and another guy calls all in, original raiser calls. I flop a set and stack the original raiser who had KJ for almost 200 pounds.

[pokerswami]

Thanks for your report. I enjoyed it.

[ QUOTE ]
...from what I could tell, no dealer tipping, because I never saw someone tip the dealer. I never tipped the dealer, but of course, I never won a pot either

[/ QUOTE ]

Seems like your trip report included a few wins. Maybe the small wins were with a dealer and the decent wins were without a house supplied dealer.

[context]

Nice report, sounds like a decent place for a newbie to start off. I think by law you're not allowed to tip dealers in most UK casinos, and this funny law extends to rakes as well - but I can't remember the exact details.

[ijustliketoplay]

nice rep.

it is against the law to rake or tip the dealer in the uk. thats why u have the time charge.

this will all change in september though.

and anyone thinking self dealt is more fun needs to play it a few times more. the novelty definitely wears off!

[Bonified]

Your impressions of the various games are spot on. PLHE is pretty tough, PLO is full of rocks and self-deal games are soft but have a lot of angle-shooters. Nice report.

[Paul Levy]

[ QUOTE ]
I was in London for a business trip and decided to play some poker at the Grosvenor Victoria Casino "The Vic" near central London.
[...]

On to the action (all figures in Pounds)...

I re-bought and played longer, play was fairly tight and pretty good, some players were predictable, but others were good.

[/ QUOTE ]

You were unlucky - usually game is very loose and bad players outnumber good ones 3 to 1. Also, it's tough to shortstack that game, being PL makes it hard to defend your big starting hands out of position.

[yanfu]

I felt extremely short stacked in this PL game. 3/3 blinds are pretty huge, and even though the game was tight, I could see pots getting big very quickly.

I feel if I wasn't short stacked, I could have bought the pocket tens pot on the turn, but my read is tainted by events that happened after the fact.

There seemed to be some wealthy regulars in this PLHE game that would make it profitable, but a couple tough spots for sure, but it felt like the zoo-like 1/2 tables could be exploited for some serious profit though.

Also, I feel like the self-deal tables are an environment that could generate a really solid player; It's very raw and there is a lot more information to process than in a typical hold-em game. Also, the game requires much more concentration because you need to be a lot more active in managing the weak dealers and angle shooters -- in some cases dealing and playing at the same time.

I felt the Omaha game was much weaker, with a lot of very predictable play, adjusting to the structure is very tricky though. This ante-like (Running 1 Pound) game gives you the ability to manipulate the pot size before the flop a lot easier than in a typical 2 blind game and this is effected by how many players are dealt into the game. Seemed like picking up small to medium sized pots pre-flop or on the flop could be quite easy here.

[marty_palin]

great report, glad you liked it. Never been myself