200nl: I 4 bet QQ vs 2 players ... call the poosh???

[Mr_Donktastic]

PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $2 BB (5 handed) internettexasholdem.com

Button ($202.75)
Hero ($206.05)
BB ($309.15)
UTG ($194)
MP ($212.70)

Preflop: Hero is SB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP raises to $6</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Button raises to $21</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $66</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP raises to $212.7</font>, Button folds, Hero ?

No read on villian. Can I call this? Is this ever NOT AA/KK?

Should I have just flat called in the first place?

[Josem]

I think you have to fold to the push.


The first raise (MP) can be a fairly wide range.

The second raise (Button) must be a tighter range.

The third raise (You) must be a very tight range - You can be no wider than QQ+, maybe AK if you're out there.

The fourth raise (MP's push) must be incredibly bloody tight. I think this is AA more than half the time.

[The White Rabbit]

Fold, but just call the 3-bet.

[cowpig]

Folding here is awful aful awful. Definitely call.
If you don't want to get all in preflop do not 4bet QQ.

[kayfish77]

i think i just shove the first time around since from my experience at 1/2 you get looked up lighter than 4betting 3x. people saying folding is awful are idiots since youre an 80:20 underdog ALOT of the time and a 58:42 favorite a very small percent of the time. this is never jacks or something we have crushed, and calling is definitely -ev. fwiw id like this play alot more with suited connectors than QQ if you're going to pitch it to a shove. Do you have stats on either player? fwiw you seem to be bluffing preflop with QQ since no better hands fold and no worse hands except possibly AK call.

[aseHigh]

[ QUOTE ]
Folding here is awful aful awful. Definitely call.
If you don't want to get all in preflop do not 4bet QQ.

[/ QUOTE ]

As played you could argue a call but I'd prolly fold unless I know the villain pretty well and know he is capable of making this move with other than AA/KK. Otherwise please call the 3 Bet unless you have positive reads on MP and Btn being on fairly wide ranges.

[HoldenFoldem]

Oddly enough, your 4bet may have saved u a lot of money, by getting the guy to pretty much tell u what he has. NH

[FGators]

It's either AA/KK or AK (Which you see a lot here). Still I hate praying for the times AK shows up here. You have to fold.

[SkyyCaptain]

Yeah, even if it was AK you're only 56-43. Lay it down unless you think the villain could be making a move with trash but how many villains are THAT aggro?