Should 2+2 endorse PPA?

[TheEngineer]

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Hopefully, Mat has already sent Eng a PM...

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Nope. Nothing from 2+2. Not expecting anything.

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Mat has since sent me a PM. Thanks Mat.

[Sniper]

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Hopefully, Mat has already sent Eng a PM...

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Nope. Nothing from 2+2. Not expecting anything.

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Mat has since sent me a PM. Thanks Mat.

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Thx Mat [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

[Tarheel]

I don't know what all the fuss is about. Seems to me that Mason made a simple request regarding his business, and that should be respected. I doubt Mason sends many PM's and him giving an explanation of his position does not constitute as talking down to anyone.

That said, we all appreciate your efforts Engineer. I've been following your action plans since they started and continue to do so. This however is the 2nd time i've seen you blow up at very minor things. Your letter to the PPA could have simply been resent with the added caveat that you "in no way represent the management nor the official position of TwoPlusTwo Publishing". I realize that you are passionate about this, but remaining professional in discussion will get you a lot further. I am with you though Engineer, so let's get back on track!!

[Sparta45]

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I always find in these discussions that there is an unspoken concept that citizens can do nothing in the face of government greed. That is, when taxes rise, "well, that's just the way it is - nothing you can do." Being a man of many "questions", I ask myself, "why not? Why can't I demand lower taxes and spending?" Of course, I can, but one of the problems with people today is that they feel powerless and don't get off the couch or contact the public SERVANTS who were elected to serve THEM, not the other way around. If people aren't going to tell their legislators what they want them to do, then yes, government will probably grow larger, consuming more money, raising taxes, and then not only will online poker die, but lots of things will (if the power to tax is the power to destroy).

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I agree with you in theory....however, in reality, I have probably sent 12 to 15 letters to various "public servants" over the past 12 months or so. Exactly "one" has responded to me at all. And that was a form letter.

Unfortunately, it just seems that unless you are part of a huge lobby group with lots of $$$ or unless you happen to be very well connected, your voice isn't going to be heard.

[Dunkman]

My experience has been that elected representatives do indeed respond to communication from their constituents.

[TheEngineer]

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I agree with you in theory....however, in reality, I have probably sent 12 to 15 letters to various "public servants" over the past 12 months or so. Exactly "one" has responded to me at all. And that was a form letter.

Unfortunately, it just seems that unless you are part of a huge lobby group with lots of $$$ or unless you happen to be very well connected, your voice isn't going to be heard.

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Barney Frank mentioned that these politicians do keep track of their constituents' comments, so I think it's important that we keep writing. As for your experiences, typically you'll hear back only from your own congressman and senators. The others may (or may not....I know Rep. Frank and Rep. Paul do read them) read them, but I believe they cannot send mail outside their district (rep) or state (senator), at least for free (it's called "franking"....postage-free mail to constituents).

I hope we'll all continue writing and calling. Our opponents sure are.

[TheEngineer]

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"First, once government gets a taste of the revenue they wont want to kill the goose that lays the golden eggs. "

i dont think gov works this way. local and state politicians want to make a positive difference. they want better roads, better schools, new sports stadiums, parks and trails, and community programs. unfortunately the funding is lacking. historically, they have raised taxes and the easiest place to raise taxes is on tobacco and alcohol. i dont have hard numbers and im too lazy to look it up but i know cigs went up .25c recently and can remember at least 2 other tax raises there.

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I don't disagree with your concerns at all. However, I don't think doing nothing is viable, either. Our opponents are committed to putting us out of business. I thought this quesiton was important enough to start a new thread, so I did, at Future of Online Poker in the USA .

[seemorenuts]

We should first examine the role of poker in our culture for the next 500 years from the perspective of our governments. Opinions such as Kurt Vonnegut's would be helpful here too--(but he died April 11th, 2007).

If players could organize and be patient re delayed gratification, a set up that would not involve taxes can be trivially set up--nominially no cash changes hands, it would be via networked computers, whether people are face-to-face or not (I realize this sounds terribly redundant/obvious but it's not).

Poker certainly has its place in education.
Placed in its appropriate context children should benefit from learning the logic and beauty that the game provides.

All of the above should be considered in the efforts to keep poker alive, but it is realistic to accept that it will evolve within our culture over time.

[Emperor]

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We should first examine the role of poker in our culture for the next 500 years from the perspective of our governments. Opinions such as Kurt Vonnegut's would be helpful here too--(but he died April 11th, 2007).

If players could organize and be patient re delayed gratification, a set up that would not involve taxes can be trivially set up--nominially no cash changes hands, it would be via networked computers, whether people are face-to-face or not (I realize this sounds terribly redundant/obvious but it's not).

Poker certainly has its place in education.
Placed in its appropriate context children should benefit from learning the logic and beauty that the game provides.

All of the above should be considered in the efforts to keep poker alive, but it is realistic to accept that it will evolve within our culture over time.

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I am sure this is irrelevant considering in 43 years the Messiah returns to rule for the next 1000 years. My understanding is that we will be doing much more important things during those years other than playing poker.