Two short stack felting decisions from $50r

[Soulman]

aplunk,

the difference betweeen cEV and $EV is negligible at this point - we're nowhere near the money yet. The chips you win here are worth _more_ than the chips you lose - they'll give you FE back, which is of course critical. The math error is trivial enough that the effect is close to negligible as well, max 1%.

I'm with mastr that you need a good read that villain will push wide in order to make the call though. If you do, I don't really see a problem in calling and gambling to get a stack again, even if it's slightly -EV. Either way, it's close enough that it's not a big error, and the expected future gain (with having FE again) makes it a call I don't think is bad.

[kurtkatt]

why is it better to call off your chips with j3 than pushing 97o with 10bb??

[bigballz]

posItion game poker is

[registrar]

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why is it better to call off your chips with j3 than pushing 97o with 10bb??

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It's ranges, innit? In #2, I'm up against one player, closing the action. It's a pretty straightforward calculation. If he's pushing the top 64% (was it?) of his hands there, calling is +cEV. I think he is (he was, he had J3s but I flopped my flush booyah). The other issue is whether I can afford to fold. Which is to say, even if calling is -cEV, I would guess that we are not likely to find a +cEV or less -cEV spot in the next 7 hands.

97o from UTG+1 is a fold. We have more FE (being in EP and shoving 10BBs) but the CO can call comfortably and the BB can make a pot odds call closing the action. And, of course, with 7 players left to act, there is a reasonable chance that someone wakes up with a big hand. I think there are reasons for making a -cEV shove here: the blinds are going up and we're straight into them so we're losing all FE and we're not likely to find a better spot, I had a tight image, people respect EP raises. I'd shove 98s here for sure.

[hamnegger]

how is 7-9 above average? and against a callers range its a piece of swish cheese.

[registrar]

I'm guessing it's a top 50% hand and not in bad shape agaisnt overcards. You're stuffed v medium pairs+ obv.

The point is that you're 50/50 to get a better hand UTG and then you're in BB with M=3.

It's not a push but with all factors considered, it's not far off. The whole point of the thread is that two spots that most would write off as easy folds aren't actually that clear.

Edit: basically, there comes a point where all spots are likely to be -cEV and we don't have the luxury of choosing a +cEV spot but simply of deciding which -cEV spot is the best of a bad lot.

[kurtkatt]

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why is it better to call off your chips with j3 than pushing 97o with 10bb??

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It's ranges, innit? In #2, I'm up against one player, closing the action. It's a pretty straightforward calculation. If he's pushing the top 64% (was it?) of his hands there, calling is +cEV. I think he is (he was, he had J3s but I flopped my flush booyah). The other issue is whether I can afford to fold. Which is to say, even if calling is -cEV, I would guess that we are not likely to find a +cEV or less -cEV spot in the next 7 hands.

97o from UTG+1 is a fold. We have more FE (being in EP and shoving 10BBs) but the CO can call comfortably and the BB can make a pot odds call closing the action. And, of course, with 7 players left to act, there is a reasonable chance that someone wakes up with a big hand. I think there are reasons for making a -cEV shove here: the blinds are going up and we're straight into them so we're losing all FE and we're not likely to find a better spot, I had a tight image, people respect EP raises. I'd shove 98s here for sure.

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ok, i clearly agree we should go with one of these spots. but thinking possible FE is better than just calling in a very marginal spot? further, if we fold this 97 we are actually hoping to get a better spot in just 2 hands, this time maybe we got one slightly better but is that a good gameplan?

[james129]

2nd is a call....you have no fold equity in sb next hand. You are just looking to get in a coin flip sittuation and get lucky. COs range is huge and includes less than J high imo.....89s, 910s