I want to buy Hand History data

bziegler2 · #1 12-30-2005, 03:17 PM

I'm working on a project that will model opponents for Texas Hold'em. To do this I need lots of Hand History files for different types of players (loose, tight, aggressive, passive, etc). And to create an accurate model, they can't be observed hands, I need to have the player hole cards for at least one player.

Ideally I will be able to get 30k-50k hands per *type* of player. I would be willing to pay for this information.

Does anyone know of a website where I could buy this? Would anyone be willing to sell me their data?

If privacy is a concern, I could write a small utility that would "anonymize" your Hand History files before you send them, so that your name & opponent names are changed to something different.

Buckmulligan · #2 12-30-2005, 03:21 PM

If you detail the project and share the information, I'm sure many of the posters would be willing to contribute for free.

bziegler2 · #3 12-30-2005, 03:29 PM

I would certainly take any HH files people donate! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] And if someone says I can share their data, I will. But of course I would respect anyone's privacy wishes first.

As for more detail on the project, I'm not 100% sure how it will work. But the basic idea is that I would have a model for different playing styles. I would also write a program that could take a new players information (obviously just that seen at showdown), and see how closely it "fits" each of the different models. There might be some kind of scoring function, like 80% tight, 20% loose, etc.

If the classification piece works, stage 2 (which would be much harder), would use the opponent model you have picked for a player to try to guess what hole cards he has.

I would certainly be willing to share my results with anyone who contributes some useful HH information (i.e., >30k hands).

Annorax · #4 12-30-2005, 03:35 PM

[ QUOTE ]
I would certainly take any HH files people donate! [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] And if someone says I can share their data, I will. But of course I would respect anyone's privacy wishes first.

As for more detail on the project, I'm not 100% sure how it will work. But the basic idea is that I would have a model for different playing styles. I would also write a program that could take a new players information (obviously just that seen at showdown), and see how closely it "fits" each of the different models. There might be some kind of scoring function, like 80% tight, 20% loose, etc.

If the classification piece works, stage 2 (which would be much harder), would use the opponent model you have picked for a player to try to guess what hole cards he has.

I would certainly be willing to share my results with anyone who contributes some useful HH information (i.e., >30k hands).

[/ QUOTE ]

So in short, you're laying the groundwork for a piece of AI that can not only play on autopilot, but can also attempt to read hands? This sounds interesting.

I don't have much of a database, at most 100-200 hands per player, and it's all Absolute and Stars, but you're welcome to it. PM me if you're interested.

bziegler2 · #5 12-30-2005, 03:39 PM

[ QUOTE ]
So in short, you're laying the groundwork for a piece of AI that can not only play on autopilot, but can also attempt to read hands?

[/ QUOTE ]

No, its not meant to play for you, but it would be a tool to help you figure out your opponents. Sort of like PAHUD displaying their stats on the table. This would say "30% chance he has a pair, 20% chance top pair", etc. And hopefully it would be real-time so it would be useful.

pokergrader · #6 12-30-2005, 04:39 PM

This certainly would qualify as a bot, but it is interesting nonetheless.

miked002 · #7 12-30-2005, 04:50 PM

Sounds like a great idea. I have no problems participating if I feel comfortable with your "anonymize" tool. PM me with the details.

Buckmulligan · #8 12-30-2005, 04:52 PM

Why is being anonymous such a big deal for hand histories?

miked002 · #9 12-30-2005, 05:11 PM

I would rather not sit down at a table with 9 other players that have 50k hands of experience with me.

I think this project is worthwhile, but I want to make sure I am not feeding into a large db for someone's personal gain. The anonymous factor would satisfy my itch.

Maybe I am paranoid and off base on this one. What do you think?

SamIAm · #10 12-30-2005, 05:48 PM

[ QUOTE ]
Maybe I am paranoid and off base on this one. What do you think?

[/ QUOTE ]I understand what you're saying, but I think it might be unnecessary. If I have 5k hands on you (and I do. [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] ) then I'll know you're tight and aggressive. Give me 50k, and I'll know pretty much the same thing.

Maybe if I study the data longer, I can find some holes in your game. Maybe you continuation bet the flop but won't ever follow-through on the turn. Whatever. These are NOTHING compared to just playing against bad players to begin with. If I see a bunch of you guys at my table, I'm likely to move, regardless of whether I know how often you steal the blinds to 4 sig figs.

At mid-stakes ($15/$30 and up) I'll believe these detailed details matter, because you see the same players so often, and because more of the table will fit the general "Tight Aggressive" label. But at small stakes ($2/$4 to $10/$20), I'll happily give you a wider window into my play in exchange for thousands of hands on the fish.
-Sam