Ivey playing golf

[Daddy Warbucks]

[ QUOTE ]

P.S. The difficult part for Patrik and Tuan was coming up with good song choices.

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm Too Sexy by Right Said Fred, obviously!

[bones]

Barry,

You mentioned people fighting over use of Tuan's poker account because they can get so much action with it. Do you feel that it's in any way unethical to use another person's account for the express purpose of deceiving online opponents? What if the account is a sponsored player from the site, like say Ivey on FT or Raymer on Stars?

[Q_and_A]

Most golf bets are won and lost on the first tee.

[Micturition Man]

[ QUOTE ]

If Internet poker really goes down, I expect some of the online phenoms will get hurt against the top live players, because they will be playing their value too much and will be giving out information. It would be fun to play with some of them in the big game at the Bellagio, but most of them can only play hold'em.

Barry

[/ QUOTE ]


This last part rubs me the wrong way.

I have always disliked the "we are the champions" attitude toward the big game that you promulgate on your website.

There are plenty of good mix game players who don't play 4k-8k yet because they simply don't have the bankrolls for it. It is not easy to come up with $4M (especially for American online players, who have to pay taxes).

You guys build your game around people like Gus and Eli and Sammy* then pat yourself on the back for being such elite players. Give me a break. I and many others would play any game with both Gus and Eli in a heartbeat if we could afford it. (That's not meant to be as disparaging to Gus as it may sound.)

Most of the 4k-8k players benefited from extraordinary bankroll growth opportunities that most younger online players have not benefited from.

This includes sports betting (Chip and Doyle), Larry Flynt (you and Phil I would imagine), winning tournaments at critical stages of their bankroll growth (Phil, for one), insider stock tips (this is just rumored), and simply having many years of play during which to have accumulated their bankrolls (Chip, Doyle, you, probably Jen).



* Sammy I've only heard to be bad at mix games by reputation.

[barryg1]

[ QUOTE ]

This last part rubs me the wrong way.

I have always disliked the "we are the champions" attitude toward the big game that you promulgate on your website.

There are plenty of good mix game players who don't play 4k-8k yet because they simply don't have the bankrolls for it. It is not easy to come up with $4M (especially for American online players, who have to pay taxes).

[/ QUOTE ]

Actually, your points are valid. I was overreacting to the online mentality that some of the online players are better than the better live-game players. They may be favorites in their specialties in their environment (online poker) against a good player that doesn't specialize, but they would have trouble in live mixed games with the best players in the world.

Barry

[J_V]

Patrick's song should be some euro techno from Zoolander obv.

[J_V]

[ QUOTE ]
This last part rubs me the wrong way.

I have always disliked the "we are the champions" attitude toward the big game that you promulgate on your website.

There are plenty of good mix game players who don't play 4k-8k yet because they simply don't have the bankrolls for it. It is not easy to come up with $4M (especially for American online players, who have to pay taxes).

You guys build your game around people like Gus and Eli and Sammy* then pat yourself on the back for being such elite players. Give me a break. I and many others would play any game with both Gus and Eli in a heartbeat if we could afford it. (That's not meant to be as disparaging to Gus as it may sound.)

Most of the 4k-8k players benefited from extraordinary bankroll growth opportunities that most younger online players have not benefited from.

This includes sports betting (Chip and Doyle), Larry Flynt (you and Phil I would imagine), winning tournaments at critical stages of their bankroll growth (Phil, for one), insider stock tips (this is just rumored), and simply having many years of play during which to have accumulated their bankrolls (Chip, Doyle, you, probably Jen).



* Sammy I've only heard to be bad at mix games by reputation.

[/ QUOTE ]


Great Post.

[barryg1]

Not sure of your point, unless you didn't know that Patrik was a successful live game player who decided to start playing on the internet once it got big. That's why he has such good live game table feel.

Barry

[J_V]

The live/online distinction you make is really almost non-existant in my opinion. The only difference is that you can see your opponent, and anyone that is capable of making millions of dollars online is capable of reading and conceiling tells with a little practice. We might have to agree to disagree on this point, since I don't think you will ever concede it [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img].

Patrick's "live game" feel is nothing more than he's really good at poker.

As for the mixed games, a lot of players don't know games like NL lowball single draw. But I would definitely venture that excellent players like Brian Townsend or Patrick Antonius could become very good at these games just like Ivey and yourself have. The skill set in question is poker ability, changing the medium only gives the older players a termporary advantage.

[jmill2511]

[ QUOTE ]
The live/online distinction you make is really almost non-existant in my opinion. The only difference is that you can see your opponent, and anyone that is capable of making millions of dollars online is capable of reading and conceiling tells with a little practice. We might have to agree to disagree on this point, since I don't think you will ever concede it [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

I agree about the onlive/live thing and alot of live pros are very wrong in underestimating a player just because he plays online. However, while live pros often give online pros less credit/respect it goes both ways now. Alot of the online players seem to think that because they 6 table online and post on 2+2 that they would somehow crush live pros now. It's incredibly foolish to think this way. It's really just dependent on the player, not whether or not he plays online/live. Some players are going to work harder at being well roundend and others wont. The people who underestimate another player just because they play online/live are only hurting themselves in doing so.