2 K-high calldowns

[Redeye]

I very rarely show down king high, but did in these two spots. What do people think? I have seen a rash of these turn donks lately and they almost always seem to be a picked up draw, a complete bluff, or top pair on the flop that decided this was the best line to take.


First hand: Villian 70/40/1.7.

PokerStars 5/10 Hold'em (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is MP with K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img].
UTG calls, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, BB calls, UTG calls.

Flop: (6.40 SB) 7[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(3 players)</font>
BB checks, UTG checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, BB folds, UTG calls.

Turn: (4.20 BB) 8[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, Hero calls.

River: (6.20 BB) Q[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">UTG bets</font>, Hero calls.


Villian on the laggier side, something like a 35/20 type of a guy. My plan was to fold on the river in this hand to a river bet if a diamond or club hit.

PokerStars 5/10 Hold'em (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

Preflop: Hero is CO with K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img].
<font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">MP raises</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero 3-bets</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, MP calls.

Flop: (7.40 SB) 9[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
MP checks, <font color="#CC3333">Hero bets</font>, MP calls.

Turn: (4.70 BB) 3[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
<font color="#CC3333">MP bets</font>, Hero calls.

River: (6.70 BB) 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font>
MP checks, Hero checks.

[jstill]

if ur read on these villain's donks is its much more often a bluff/semi-bluff then these are fine I think (this is typically the case I think). at the table id probably just fold both tho and give him credit for good timing.

[511 Peas]

Tell me, since we think the Villan has absolutely nothing (this question refers to the first hand), is anyone of the opinion that we should raise him instead of simply calling? I am but a low-stakes player newer to 6-max, and this is a serious question to which I honestly don't know the answer.

It just hits me that maybe outright aggression may increase our chances to win and may be more important than a decision that makes little sense as to expected value??

Please share your thoughts with this beginning/intermediate player (me). Thank you.

[Saikkonen]

Hand 1:
I was in sort of the same situation today. I raised with QTo from CO and a thinking maniac reraised me from the SB. I just called. The flop were all rags. I did know that villain did know that I probably didn't hit the flop. Anyway we capped the flop I didn't wanna give my hand away. I called him down with Q high and he showed Q5o paired with a 5 on the flop. After this experience I felt weak and maybe I should have made a second attack on the turn at least. In the long run I reasoned that he kind of earned his hand because he was able to take the chance that i didn't have any pocketpairs and now I think in the long run against these players a fold is correct and call them down when you have the goods. You will win more than you loose and you can occasionally bluff them if the board looks scary to him.

So in this place - if I play the turn - then raise it up.

Hand 2:
This is a normal player with normal standards(maybe a little loose). I would let it go on the turn I think

[PokerSparky]

You need more than a stats read to call the turns here IMO. K high calls are often about game dynamics and how you and villain have been playing in previous hands IMO.

Edit: That being said, I don't have any particular problem with a calldown in hand 1 give villain's stats, though I probably just fold and wait for a better spot to look him up.

[TheWunderkind]

i would calldown with A high in Hand 1 for sure, K high is alittle tougher but with his stats it can not be horrible, Hand 2 id fold

as said you need to have better reads than pure stats