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#1
03-29-2007, 12:08 PM
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Preflop 4bet, followed by flop check/fold, like?
Don't know villain too well, but he's playing 28/24-ish and is getting slightly out of hand preflop. Still, it looks like he's a pretty solid player and I haven't done anything out of line yet.
PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em, $4 BB (6 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums) Hero ($400) MP ($774.60) CO ($765.85) Button ($388) SB ($537.40) BB ($331) Preflop: Hero is UTG with A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $16</font>, <font color="#666666">1 fold</font>, <font color="#CC3333">CO raises to $48</font>, <font color="#666666">3 folds</font>, <font color="#CC3333">Hero raises to $145</font>, CO calls $97. Flop: ($296) 4[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 2[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img], T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] <font color="#0000FF">(2 players)</font> Hero checks, <font color="#CC3333">CO bets $260</font>, Hero folds. Final Pot: $556 Thoughts: My 4bet should've cleared out most of the garbage pocket pairs, and JJ-QQ is likely calling a push given the 4bet call preflop. He could have AK, but I'd expect that to raise all in preflop more than just flat call for nearly half his stack. I could have some folding equity vs. a stubborn 99-88, but that's a pretty small part of his hand range at this point. 
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#4
03-29-2007, 12:25 PM
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Re: Preflop 4bet, followed by flop check/fold, like?
[ QUOTE ]
Um, preflop shove is a huge overbet for 100BB yes? [/ QUOTE ] No pretty standard especially because your hand is suited.
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#5
03-29-2007, 02:22 PM
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Re: Preflop 4bet, followed by flop check/fold, like?
I really don't get why a huge overbet all in is standard here. Are you doing this with AA/KK as well to balance it out? And if we're pushing, does the fact that we're suited make that much of a difference?
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#6
03-29-2007, 02:53 PM
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Re: Preflop 4bet, followed by flop check/fold, like?
i shove any flop
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#9
03-29-2007, 03:20 PM
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Re: Preflop 4bet, followed by flop check/fold, like?
[ QUOTE ]
i dont think i even like the 4 bet, if youre gonna check fold the flop i would keep it to 3 as long as your OOP [/ QUOTE ] this is crazy he 3-bets a lottttt more hands than he calls this 4-bet with. The reason why he c/f's the flop is because the guy called the 4-bet. He's not calling the 3bet and then c/f'ing the flop.
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#10
03-30-2007, 01:23 PM
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Re: Preflop 4bet, followed by flop check/fold, like?
[ QUOTE ]
I really don't get why a huge overbet all in is standard here. Are you doing this with AA/KK as well to balance it out? And if we're pushing, does the fact that we're suited make that much of a difference? [/ QUOTE ] Yes, that's the exact reason. You push AA/KK and AKs exclusively. This means 12 times you have AA or KK and 4 times you have AKs. So every 16 games you should win 12 times (*.8) and those 4 games you win 2 or 1.8. So every 12 games you win 9.6+1.8=11.4. Approximately about 71.25% of the time. You can only do this if you don't play above your limit because it's high volatile but this is the basic idea. AKs vs QQ has 46% and AKo vs QQ has 42%. AKs is a LOT better and that's the first reason to limit your pushing range, the second is the following. The second reason if you also push AKo you will have AA, KK, 12 times and AKo 16 times. Who is folding QQ now against you? Not a lot of players (falsely!!!). And even if your opponent knows your pushing range he would fold QQ even if you push AKo/AA/KK. But a lot of opponents are not that smart so you would give up edge by pushing AKo, but it's profitable though... Watch this table: Push AA /KK/Ako <ul type="square"> Hand ** # ** W *** L *** Result AA/KK * 12 * 80% * 20% * 7,2 AKs *** 4 ** 46% * 54% * -0,32 AKo *** 12 * 42% * 58% * -1,92 4,96 [/list]<ul type="square"> Push AA/KK/Aks Hand ** # ** W *** L *** Result AA/KK * 12 * 80% * 20% * 7,2 AKs *** 4 ** 46% * 54% * -0,32 6,88 [/list] If the opponent would play perfect he would fold any pair against your push except AA or KK. If this opponent folds any pair against you except AA or KK it would be better to push them all against QQ, JJ or worse because obviously you are not calling with AKs you are pushing yourself so your opponent will probably fold AKs if you push. The problem is, the opponent will call with QQ way too often to include AKo to your pushing range. A large part of the profit comes from hands that go to showdown and not the preflop stealing. So..... At least against me no-one ever fold [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img] That's why i limit it to AKs. Sometimes if they call very very easy i might even only push AK suited, black. And against a maniac who calls ANY pair, i only push AA or KK, no deception needed. Was I clear in the post i am doing my best to be clear..... ?
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