Alan Schoonmaker's Opinion For My Next Book

[jjshabado]

1.) I think Harrington proved that a book of hands can be successful. I'd love a limit cash game version of that book.

2.) The what Poker teaches us could be very successful. Think about how well Freakonomics did. I'm thinking a book in the same mold, but based on poker theory, could be very interesting.

3.) I have a number of issues with Dr. Schoonmaker's educational opinions, but I don't see how anybody with any reasonable level of poker knowledge can think that tying student performance to teacher compensation is a good idea. The number of variables that impact student performance are enormous. A mediocre teacher can achieve a lot of improvement with a talented kid, and a great teacher can only achieve a small amount of improvement with a slow-learner kid.

[MTBlue]

You need to look at the moral issue involved in this. There are plenty of school systems that will be opposed to this book b/c it is based on "gambling," something the majority of the interior of the country views as a sin.

As for tests associated with theory of poker. I think it would be an excellent way to let people access the material.

[notagainffs]

I think that the 50 hands would be a great book. certain hands that make you think can tell you as much about poker than pages and pages of text. i'd buy it.

with the simplified TOP, why not have one that focuses on just texas hold'em, this is by far the most popular game and when i was reading TOP i often found myself switching off when reading examples of other games - though admittedly i'll probably go back and read them again when i get more interested in other poker games.

[Yeti]

David,

I think anyone with half a brain got tired of discussing this in the other thread. You claim you are close to being one of the best algebra teachers in the world. So go and write a f'ing book on algebra? Won't that give you a greater sense of satisfaction than hashing out some half-hearted book on hand examples?

[daveT]

I don't like the watered-down TOP idea for two reasons.

1- The original TOP was writen back in the late seventies, specifically made for professionals. Even in the intro, Sklansky states that the present version is made to be more accessable for the average player. There was also a second version created (very hard to find), that was written with a professional in the early 90's, that is supposed to be the best version.

The current version of TOP is the third easiest as it is.

2- The last thing that we all should be doing is encouraging absolutely everyone to take up poker or any other form of professional gambling because it is easy. There is already the Frank Scobletts, Avery Cardozas and John Patricks in this world for that sort of Bull S--T.

[m1illion]

[ QUOTE ]

If a known rapist, child molester, wrote the only book that could raise your child's algebra grade from a B to a C, and you didn't purchase it because of his crimes, you should have your child taken from you.



[/ QUOTE ]

Raise from a
B to a C????????????????
Typical DS
completely ass backward

[PokrLikeItsProse]

[ QUOTE ]
Alan's points are good. I've commented in other thread to, putting my point of view, and giving link which shows discussion by your 'typical' market.

But I don't understand why ppl find ToP 'difficult', but then again they don't probably try to deduce/calculate stuff for themselves when they start playing (using probability and Dave Scharf's Beginner's book).

[/ QUOTE ]

It's fairly simple. Some people find ToP difficult because it has non-hold em content. That's one explanation for a subset of people who don't like the book.

That is why, in the other thread, I suggested that David Sklansky write a book pared down to fit in the $15-20 price range with only hold em examples for all of the concepts and that he title this book "The Theory of Hold Em".

[burty1]

I have taught math at the high school level for 10 years...everything from Algebra I to Calculus...

Is he/are you serious with some of these comments?

"The educational establishment is EXTRAORDINARILY resistant to change. For
example, lectures became obsolete when the printing press was invented five
centuries ago, but they are still the primary instructional method."
Lecturing, as you call it, will NEVER be obsolete in math. Students need examples modeled by an expert (teacher), while the expert thinks aloud. The majority of students at the high school level cannot read a math textbook and get out of it what they need to get out of it...You obviously don't understand what it means to be a teacher...Teachers are constantly attending conferences/taking classes, along with self-evaluations, looking for ways to improve instruction and learning...

"Teachers and administrators are EXTREMELY opposed to anything that improves
performance or even allows it to be measured. The teachers’ unions were the
most vociferous opponents of the proficiency tests, and they absolutely
insist that teachers’ compensation should be based on non-performance
criteria. In fact, they have fought against nearly every attempt to improve
American students’ abysmal performance on tests of math, science, etc."
Boy oh boy...these comments get better and better...Teachers object to proficiency tests NOT because we fear being judged, but because we object to people at the state level telling us how/what should be taught when most of them have not been in the classroom in years. My school district (in Ohio) has been near the top of the state every year in proficiency scores. I am absolutely opposed to rewards based upon performance. Should the teachers in inner-city Cleveland be penalized when their scores are lower than mine (or should I be rewarded because my scores are higher)...It may be a good day for a teacher in that environment if everyone shows up to class on time and a fight doesn't break out...Now, before you say that sounds racist, I will ask: Have you ever been in a school environment like that? I have!!...and it's not pretty at times...To use a poker analogy, you have to play the cards you are dealt...sometimes the hand is not pretty. As far as our scores compared with foreign students' scores, I'm assuming you know that in many countries, kids are tracked into different paths at an early age. When American students' scores are compared with those students from a foreign country, they are VERY skewed...and the last I checked, the U.S. was doing pretty well in the global economy, so something must be working in our educational system...

"Textbooks are purchased by bureaucracies, and the decisions have almost
nothing to do with how well a book teaches. It is an extremely centralized
and politicized process, which is completely different from the way 2+2 has
sold books."
Do you have any idea how textbooks are purchased for classrooms??? We just purchased new math textbooks at my school 2 years ago. The process is this: We notify publishing companies that we are looking to purchase textbooks. We receive literally dozens or more textbooks from companies to browse. We sit down as a math department (no administration involved) and discuss each book individually...pros and cons...a group decision is made amongst educators (some with upwards of 35 years in the education system)

Very typical...everyone can coach/teach/do the job better from a distance than the people who are actually on the frontlines...

I took 13 math classes in college starting with Calculus 1...the hardest part of being a math teacher is 2 fold...talking/breaking it down into terms they can understand and being patient when they don't...

It's the teachers fault when students don't perform well...but when students do perform well it is because they are excellent students...

Teaching = A thankless job

[Lestat]

I think you should write a book on the pratical uses of math in every day life.

I'm being serious. Just from reading your posts, I've learned many practical uses for Bayesian theory for example, that I never would have thought to apply it to.

The book could be about teaching people to make better life decisions through a practical use of math, logic, and odds. An understanding most people already have, yet don't know how to apply it, or understand how, when , or why it's important.

[popniklas]

[ QUOTE ]
I think you should write a book on the pratical uses of math in every day life.

I'm being serious. Just from reading your posts, I've learned many practical uses for Bayesian theory for example, that I never would have thought to apply it to.

The book could be about teaching people to make better life decisions through a practical use of math, logic, and odds. An understanding most people already have, yet don't know how to apply it, or understand how, when , or why it's important.

[/ QUOTE ]

That would actually rock.