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#1
03-03-2007, 01:28 PM
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Two suited broadways on the button.
Ok, on the post on raising two suited broadways from the blinds, I forgot to add, and it should be obvious, that these hands also play well from late position. I always raise them from the button, and frequently from the CO and Hijack seats.
Online 10-20 game. Two loose limpers in MP, about 35% vpip, I have KJ of diamonds on the button. I raise. Coldcalling specialist in the SB calls, BB calls, one limper folds!? and the other one calls. 9sbs and 4 players to flop Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]5 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]. Checked to me, and I bet. SB, and MP call. Three to the turn, 8 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. Check, check, and I check. I know that there is a case to be made for betting here, but at the same time, I am pretty sure that I am behind somehow, and I figure that I might be able to make up the missed bet on the river, if I hit. River, 2 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. SB checks, MP bets, I raise, and he calls. 
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#3
03-03-2007, 02:03 PM
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Re: Two suited broadways on the button.
I can understand your rationale behind checking the turn, but you are probably going to win this pot more than 1/3 of the time, and you are only contributing 1/3 of the pot. Plus, you have position with a hand that will be extremely difficult to call a bet with if you miss (which is something you check might solicit). I've taking down pots like this too often by value betting the turn and then checking behind on a missed river to pass up that turn bet.
Your rationale of thinkig you'll make up for it on the river is only flawed because of the possibility that you might get those extra bets on the river anyway (and possibly more if the pot is big enough), so it's hard to call them "extra". Otherwise, nice play.
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#5
03-03-2007, 05:46 PM
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Re: Two suited broadways on the button.
[ QUOTE ]
If they both call the turn bet, you make money. If only one calls you may be able to win UI. Bet the turn. Also, you are rarely getting checkraised. [/ QUOTE ] With all those middle cards out there, I thought that the limper had part of the board, and I also thought that the SB's range, was like a limping range, and he also might have some of the board. As it turned out, the limper, who called me on the river had KT( for second pair) and I don't think that he was ever going to fold to one bet at any point in the hand, especially since he called my river raise. If I had bet the turn, and then bet the river, I would have captured two bets from him, and possibly one more bet from the SB. So I might have lost out on one bet by playing the way I did, but at the same time, I was able to put in my two bets when I probably had over 90% pot equity, instead of putting in one bet at neutral and one bet with high equity. With three opponents, I would always make that bet, but with two, I feel like sometimes I make the bet, and get called by one player, so I've made a play with negative equity. Against one opponent here, the chance that I will win immediately makes the bet easy, because the chance that I will take the pot down right there is high. Its just with two opponents that I consider checking.
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#7
03-04-2007, 03:24 AM
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Re: Two suited broadways on the button.
i'd bet the turn as well.
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#8
03-04-2007, 06:20 AM
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Re: Two suited broadways on the button.
I'd bet the turn, if for none of the above reasons, simply because I'm making myself more difficult for my opponents to read. Unless he has AQd, a check-raise isn't all that bad for you considering the strength of your draw. And that's worst case scenario. He might have 2 weaker diamonds or a different straight draw (even a gutshot).
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#9
03-04-2007, 08:26 AM
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Re: Two suited broadways on the button.
i'd bet the turn, huge pot equity and i think there is an understated amount of time you actually have the best hand UI and/or might take it down on the turn. kinda slim,i know, but with the huge pot equity you have you don't really need much folding equity at all. even just a little is enough.
re: making up the bets on the river the river may get checked to you anyways when you hit and you may not collect a bet on the river if they both fold and if you do hit and they bet out they may not call the raise. and also there is a chance not only could you get the bets in on the turn you may get the action you want on the river anyways.
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#10
03-04-2007, 11:30 AM
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Re: Two suited broadways on the button.
[ QUOTE ]
re: making up the bets on the river the river may get checked to you anyways when you hit and you may not collect a bet on the river if they both fold and if you do hit and they bet out they may not call the raise. [/ QUOTE ] This is especially true if you catch the top end of your OESD.
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