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  #1  
Old 02-25-2007, 08:19 PM
ZeTurd ZeTurd is offline
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Default Am I a hopeless nit?

One of the first hands in a (semi)-deepstacked €200 buyin tournament. Obviously no read on villain yet:

[ QUOTE ]
Game # 523349082 - Texas Hold'em No Limit 15/25 - Table "Tournament Table €100,000 GUARANTEE 2579899 49"

Players(max 9):
Grim_OAK (4 975,00 in seat 1)
piso59 (4 900,00 in seat 3)
canon1 (4 985,00 in seat 4)
mrpoukker (4 975,00 in seat 5)
ralferi (4 950,00 in seat 6)
Lamour (4 875,00 in seat 7)
SAKMAJDIK (5 190,00 in seat 8)
cropkill (5 150,00 in seat 9)

Dealer: cropkill
Small Blind: Grim_OAK (15,00)
Big Blind: piso59 (25,00)

Grim_OAK was dealt: 6d - 6c

canon1 Fold
mrpoukker Fold
ralferi Fold
Lamour Call (25,00)
SAKMAJDIK Fold
cropkill Call (25,00)
Grim_OAK Call (10,00)
piso59 Check

Flop 2h - 9s - 6h

Grim_OAK Check
piso59 Check
Lamour Bet (65,00)
cropkill Call (65,00)
Grim_OAK Raise (350,00)
piso59 Fold
Lamour Call (285,00)
cropkill Call (285,00)

Turn 2h - 9s - 6h - 7h

Grim_OAK Check
Lamour Check
cropkill Check

River 2h - 9s - 6h - 7h - 9h

Grim_OAK Bet (925,00)
Lamour Fold
cropkill Raise (1 850,00)
Grim_OAK Call (925,00)


[/ QUOTE ]
Am I a hopeless nit for not pushing the river?

Edit: Removed results
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  #2  
Old 02-25-2007, 08:29 PM
Cornell Fiji Cornell Fiji is offline
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Default Re: Am I a hopeless nit?

I like to lead the flop here to build the pot. I don't want this to check through in a limped pot. This time the limp worked out for you but I think that leading out is a long run winner over the check raise (which shows a ton of strength)

Turn check is fine after two players called your sizable check raise.

I shove this river every time. The flop and turn look nothing like two pair or a set from cropkill. Why would he not 3-bet the flop with 2 pair? Would he not 3bet the flop with 22 or 99? Would he not bet the turn with 22 or 99? He is definitely betting the turn with 97 or 96 so your only concerns are 22 and 99 and I think that those hands are betting to with 3 to a flush and 3 to a straight on board. You have to shove this river.

Please delete your results if you still have time as they might bias the feedback that you receive
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  #3  
Old 02-25-2007, 08:42 PM
ZeTurd ZeTurd is offline
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Default Re: Am I a hopeless nit?

[ QUOTE ]
I like to lead the flop here to build the pot. I don't want this to check through in a limped pot. This time the limp worked out for you but I think that leading out is a long run winner over the check raise (which shows a ton of strength)

[/ QUOTE ]
In retrospect I think you're right here. The check raise was bad for both not building the pot (even though, as you say, it worked out this time) and because it revealed hand strength.

[ QUOTE ]
I shove this river every time. The flop and turn look nothing like two pair or a set from cropkill. Why would he not 3-bet the flop with 2 pair? Would he not 3bet the flop with 22 or 99? Would he not bet the turn with 22 or 99? He is definitely betting the turn with 97 or 96 so your only concerns are 22 and 99 and I think that those hands are betting to with 3 to a flush and 3 to a straight on board. You have to shove this river.

[/ QUOTE ]
With no reads on villains, I didn't find it entirely inconceivable that one of them might have 99, 97 or 96. But you're right that a raise would make a whole lot more sense than just flat calling the flop for villain(s) if one of them had one of those hands (with the possible exception of 99.)

What really threw me off was the river minraise. It felt like villain was going for value, and it seemed a bit strange to me that he would do that move with a flush after the board paired.
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  #4  
Old 02-25-2007, 08:43 PM
holdemft holdemft is offline
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Default Re: Am I a hopeless nit?

I didn't see the results, but I'm assuming cropkill had the 4 flush to your FH by your title. If you think a shove will be called, then by all means shove. I guess with no reads, you have no idea if Vil can have the wherewithall to fold a 4 flush with the possibility of the boat out there. (esp. if he has the Nut flush) Shove seems like the best play, he seems like he could get it all in there by his r/r.
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  #5  
Old 02-25-2007, 08:45 PM
holdemft holdemft is offline
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Default Re: Am I a hopeless nit?

[ QUOTE ]
What really threw me off was the river minraise. It felt like villain was going for value, and it seemed a bit strange to me that he would do that move with a flush after the board paired.

[/ QUOTE ]

Not everyone sees a FH when the board pairs. People misread boards all the time. He may think his flush(if thats what he has) is the nuts.
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  #6  
Old 02-25-2007, 10:17 PM
watevs watevs is offline
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Default Re: Am I a hopeless nit?

i like how u played this, shove riv
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  #7  
Old 02-25-2007, 10:22 PM
starstx starstx is offline
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Default Re: Am I a hopeless nit?

Shove. And I actually don't ever check-raise but that's me. I like to lead out and build the pot as well. I don't think your opponent is putting you on a boat and the board means villain could have a strong hand and be beat by your FH so I like the shove.
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  #8  
Old 02-25-2007, 10:30 PM
ZeTurd ZeTurd is offline
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Default Re: Am I a hopeless nit?

Thanks for the replies. I think we can conclude now that the correct answer is to shove; it's just that minraises scares me. [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

For the record, villain had the nut flush and I won the pot.
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