Anybody like?

[mike l.]

i might donk the turn. i like the river.

[Sebastian Knight]

I don't have much experience in hyperaggressive games and no experience at all at these limits. I'd be interested in more of the rationale behind the given line. Is the plan to call down all the way -- barring ugly turn and river cards -- once the pair comes on the flop? Are we putting villain on an essentially random hand? Or maybe we think he always raises with the top 60% and raises at random half the time with the other 40%? Any elaborations would be appreciated. Thanks.
SK

[PeterPlan]

Preflop is standard. I like the river. Alternatives to consider would be checkraising the flop in order to lead the turn if not 3 bet or donking the turn as mike suggested.

Since we are ahead often enough in that situation and in that case have probably 6 outs against us I would tend to play more aggressively than you did. For protection.

turn donk > flop raise, lead turn > the way you played it

Though its probably close.

[teddyFBI]

i feel like i'm getting leveled by an entire forum.

i HATE the river fold. Hate it. Despise it.

Do I think you're behind? Yeah, but I call this every day of the week, + twice on sundays. Other streets look fine.

[phish]

Y'know, if this was an unlimited raising when HU situation, folding is pretty clearly correct. But w/ a 4-bet cap rule, folding is probably still correct, but it's a little more iffy. I've seen people throw in that last bet w/ a hand like AA just out of frustration in situations like this, probably thinking, "*&X%$, if you got me beat.... but at least I can't be raise!!!"

[jonny quest]

Curious--I, like your brother, don't play at these stakes, so I can understand why he may have questioned your play...though clearly many seasoned Limit players here agree with your play.

Truly asking these from a place of respectful inquiry:

1) why would you call after the flop with bottom pair and a very thin draw?

2) and then call again on the turn without improvement?

No doubt, I must be thinking on a lower lever, but I would have folded after the turn.

Setting myself up for flame, what stakes-specific strategy of OP's play am I not understanding?

[phish]

Part of it's the stakes, but part of it is just the situation. You're headsup against a button raise. There is a good chance that your opponent has no pair. And to weakly check and fold with any pair is giving up too much.

Now in smaller stakes full games, you may not find yourself in HU situations post flop all that frequently, and folding bottom pair against a bettor who is likely to be more passive that higher stakes players, with a couple of people behind you to act, is generally correct.

But HU, facing an almost automatic continuation bet, folding the flop is clearly wrong.

Should he have checkraised the flop? Sometimes. Again, against more weak-tight or predictible players, the aggressive approach is better since it may win the pot right there or on the turn, and you can get safely off the hand if his opponent shows strength. But against more aggressive and tricky players, he will rarely win the hand on the flop, but may face a reraise or a turn raise, and he still won't know where he stands. So a check-call here is an acceptable approach.

On the turn, more passive opponents may check with nothing, but the typical high stakes player will be much more likely to bet with nothing, especially if he doesn't think you're the tricky aggressive kind who will check-raise with air. (That's why a tricky aggressive image is so important) Hence, you are now forced to act accordingly: meaning call more frequently, raise occaisionally, and fold sometimes. But calling the turn here is clearly not unreasonable.

The river has already been commented on.

Hope this helps.

[J_V]

[ QUOTE ]
River fold very easy.

*I feel silly posting this since it's so obvious but whatevs.

[/ QUOTE ]

I hear this a lot. The trend of folding big hands in big pots for 1 bet when you are very likely beat is back fashion. These plays are never easy in tough games with thinking players, as it can be brutally exploited without you catching on - and at best you are saving fractions of a bet.

This one is close but I folding is reasonable if he has no reason to get out of line or if you know him well.

[elindauer]

[ QUOTE ]
i feel like i'm getting leveled by an entire forum.

i HATE the river fold. Hate it. Despise it.

Do I think you're behind? Yeah, but I call this every day of the week, + twice on sundays. Other streets look fine.

[/ QUOTE ]

How can you hate it? I mean, it's got to at least be close, right? How often does a player who caps the river have a mediocre 2-pair beaten? In my experience, it's almost every time.

The rare players that cap without being ahead here are almost always maniacs. Note that the OP has experience with this player and has labeled him a TAG.

So, what are the chances that this TAG has suddenly decided to bluff-raise and blfuf-cap the river in a rather small pot? What are the chances that this solid player is value-capping 1-pair? Both seem very unlikely to (most everyone else here, I think).

my 2 cents.
Eric

PS. OP... I'd usually play your hand a bit more aggressively, but given the way you got to the river, your play is excellent, IMO.

[bicyclekick]

I like the way you played the hand fine. Sometimes I c/r that flop but check calling is probably best.

On the river, I think it's a little bit less close than people make it. you're repping a huge hand and that's just not a spot people pick to bluff in my experiance. My sd stats are above 40% too so I'm not a folder and hate 'big river folds for 1 bet' but I think folding here is the right play. If it was live act like you were bet 3 bet bluffing and throw your cards away. Given that it was online meh. I really don't think folding here opens you up to a lot more bluffs, I wouldn't worry about it.

Oh, and moneyshot yuck wtf?