Two things I'm tired of hearing (this past weekend's NFL post-mortems) - Page 5

kidcolin · #41 01-17-2007, 06:40 AM

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I think that it is almost always better to bat the ball down on fourth down. the only exception is if the pass is near or behind the line of scrimage. Again, High School kids understand this.

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The only other time is passes towards the sideline where, given the angle a DB would take to intercept it, he'd have daylight. But I agree, people saying it's instinct are wrong. Just like a QB is taught to knock down a batted pass, DBs are taught to knock it down on 4th. They probably coach this much less in the pros, figuring it's already known. This game goes as proof that these little things need to be reiterated from time to time.

Vyse · #42 01-17-2007, 08:14 AM

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Results oriented is retarded.

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Jack of Arcades · #43 01-17-2007, 08:45 AM

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So put a number on it. What percentage of the time would the Eagles have converted 4th and 15?

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25%

Jack of Arcades · #44 01-17-2007, 08:46 AM

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He should have knocked it down, period. There was no split second decision that needed to be made. These are professional players, they realize its 4th down. As he said, he was trying to score and was trying to do too much. In that situation with the lead its better to make the safe play and give the ball back to your offense

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But does that make him SELFISH? Maybe misguided, or dumb, but selfish?

HajiShirazu · #45 01-17-2007, 09:14 AM

If you want to be results oriented, why not talk about the absolutely moronic decision to challenge this play, then think to the end of the game where having a timeout almost certainly would have allowed SD to get into field goal range.

legend42 · #46 01-17-2007, 04:08 PM

Multiple quotes from different posters:

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However, he's a total clod for not covering up the ball with two hands in traffic.

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He had two hands on it.

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But once he intercepts, he has to cover up and go down when he gets into that scrum.

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There wasn't a scrum until the ball was loose.

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There was no split second decision that needed to be made.

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Of course there was. This wasn't a last-minute drive. There was 6+ minutes in a one-possession game. If he thought he could score, he should go for it.

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this wasnt a pick at the sidelines

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No, but he had a clear path to the sideline- and he was going fast in that direction- when he picked the ball off. He bobbled it on his first touch, and had to pause and turn back toward the middle of the field to gather it in. Brown stripped it as soon as he did.

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he was trying to score and was trying to do too much.

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Too much, LOL. You're crazy if you don't want a speedy DB going for the pick-6 in that situation. He scores a majority of the time he catches it cleanly (maybe an unblocked Kevin Faulk pushes him out, but that's about it) and even when he doesn't, there's a good result for SD on the play 99% of the time anyway.

If you have a bigger lead, or there's less than 3 minutes, or maybe in a few other circumstances, then you have an argument, but as it happened, he did the right thing and it was just a fluke play.

chaseUdown · #47 01-17-2007, 05:24 PM

You have LT2 on your team, bat it down on 4th down always.

Lennon · #48 01-17-2007, 08:00 PM

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I've seen high schoolers deal with this situation correctly

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Anyone who thinks "instincts take over" when the DB intercepts a 4th and 15 has obviously never played football.

It was drilled into my head by middle school not to catch a 4th down pass.

NFL players intercept 4th down passes because team goals are secondary to individual statistics. That DB was a selfish fool, although no more so than most NFL players.

Jack of Arcades · #49 01-17-2007, 08:05 PM

Wow, people are confusing the two situations. This was not 4th and 15 with 1:56 to go, it was 4th and 5 with 6:25 left. he caught the ball like 8 yards from the original LOS. 8 yards? I mean, if the guy has any chance at all of getting a significant return he should pick it off.

lastchance · #50 01-17-2007, 08:10 PM

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the counter to that is even if the Eagles convert the 4th down, they still are down by 3 and not in field goal range.

I just wasted 20 minutes of my life trying to find 4th-and-X conversion stats, came up empty. I still think a realistic EV equation would show punting is the right choice.

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pigskinrevolution.com

Yeah, a realistic ev equation shows punting is right... Yeah, I can see that.