Live $40 Image

[Frond]

Just got done playing a Live 2 hour session at a $40 NLHE table in a cardroom. I was folding a lot of trash hands as usual that most others were limping in with and calling raises etc. I wouldn't say that I was completely cold-decked for the short session but it seemed that limping with a marg hand was useless cause there was almost always a raise of at least $6-8 Preflop from someone at the table. After about 45 minutes or so, any time I called the BB or put in a PF raise I'd hardly get any action at all from the table. A few would say, "Uh oh, he's playing a hand now!" and fold. My dilemma, how do I shed this image? I know I need to play some more hands and believe me I have opened up my starting hand requirements a lot from earlier this year. I still cannot see limping in with a hand like J4o from any position and calling a $6 raise cold. I have taken the advice here a far as value bet value bet value bet and I know that bluffing at this level is pretty futile with callers like these, but should I go ahead and play a trash hand once in a while with my tight image and even raise with it for a variance play? To me it's merely spewage. My heart tells me just play ABC here at this level. Thoughts?

[erbbysam]

it seems like a $6-$8 raise preflop is really high for a $40NLHE... wait for a bit for a well above average hand and start playing back at them or just make them say ""Uh oh, he's playing a hand now!"" and then show them K7o. After a few of those they will forget your nitty image for a while but if you're letting them push you around with overbets just sit back and wait for a monster in late position that you can just cold call most of the way down with and double up nicely.

[silly_monkey]

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My dilemma, how do I shed this image?


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Raise more often. Specifically, more often in position.

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I still cannot see limping in with a hand like J4o from any position and calling a $6 raise cold.


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Good, because that would be a terrible play. Don't limp with J4 and don't call a raise.

Keep in mind that 2 hours is a pretty short session. That's probably only about 50-60 hands of live play, and its very possible to get no hands that are playable in the position that they are dealt to you in that amount of time.

[silly_monkey]

BTW, when I've played $1/2 live I've had plenty of experiences where players make some comment luck "Uh oh! He's got a hand." Just before they put their call in the middle. They need to actually tighten up against you for your tight image to be a problem. If they're not playing tighter then don't worry about it. If they are, then steal like mad until they catch on.

[Frond]

That sounds good. The blinds were 1-2, pretty standard. Only hands that I got that were playable(to me anyways)were a few small-medium pairs, AKo and JJ. The med pairs were easy to get away from after the flop as was the JJ hand when the flop came 2 over cards with 5 in on the hand and a lot of action. The AK hand I won with out a showdown. I tried to limp in with a few suited connectors but there always seemed to be a large raise after me so I folded them, esp when I was out of position. I ended up down only $20 for the session and a lot of the $ I lost was in the blinds which is going to happen I know.

[IsaacAsimov]

This is a tough one. The blinds were 0.20-0.40 I assume. That means 6-8 dollars are 15-20 BB which is alot to call with a mediocre holding like K7o. Maybe wait for a hand and reraise big preflop. Maybe try this with JJ+ and AQ+ then after a while they would cut back on there big raises. Those raises just suck, I can't really see calling such raises with too many hands.

[AKQJ10]

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My dilemma, how do I shed this image?


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Raise more often. Specifically, more often in position.

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Yep. Semibluff hands like suited aces and small pairs.

That said, you probably are reporting on a small sample. I've been in games where I thought, "Oh, damn, I raise my QQ and got a bunch of folds". But what do you know -- two orbits later I get KK, raise, and get a five-way flop.

I do give your opponents credit for noting your table image, and maybe they'll play a little tighter against you. But then along comes KJ and it's just too good to fold!

So don't slowplay, but do more semibluff preflop raising and see if you're still taking down pots. I'll be surprised if that lasts long though.

[AKQJ10]

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This is a tough one. The blinds were 0.20-0.40 I assume.

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Sorry to be rude, but you've never ever played in a public cardroom, have you? I don't think you can appreciate how different B&M play is from online. I find live $1-2 games to be substantially looser than online 10-25 cent games.

California rooms generally have 50c and sometimes even 25c chips, but they don't play much. (Maybe in the occasional $1/2 limit game.)

[AKQJ10]

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it seems like a $6-$8 raise preflop is really high for a $40NLHE...

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This is another statement that's entirely ignorant of B&M poker.

I don't mind that people post speculative ideas out of ignorance. I do it too, and I learn a lot when people correct me. It would be nice to preface your opinion with something like, "I've never played live before, so take this with a grain of a salt," so that readers can process it accordingly.

This is also why I'm not crazy about the "NL40" shorthand. Online players who've never been in a cardroom think that means 40c big blind. Live games do not have a standard max buy-in of 100 BBL, so the shorthand is deceiving.

As a matter of fact, 4 BBL PFR (assuming $1-2 blinds) is probably too little for most small-stakes live games. A decent raise in the Foxwoods $1-2 is $15, maybe $10 if the table's caught on to how tight you play.

[IsaacAsimov]

@ AKQJT

You are right I am an ignorant internet player that hasn't played in a cardroom yet [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img].

For my defence, I wrote that I assumed the BB was 0.40 and I came to this conclusion cause the post said he was playing 40NLHE, which I interpreted as 40NL.
Don't people use the term NL 200 to describe a live 1/2 game sometimes?

ps.: I didn't feel offended by your post.