25NL KK Facing Resistance with Great River

[CaseS87]

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Why a bluff? Aren't we putting him on a strong hand? People 3 barrel strong hands all the time.

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im saying the only time it makes sense to check the river is if the guy is bluffing a significant % of the time. i agree with you that most of the time the guy will have a fairly strong hand here. the point is, i don't think any 25nl player is folding a set or 2 pair on the river for such a small amount of money. (and rightly so) so if he is calling your all in 100% of the time that he would bet if checked to, plus with a lot of hands that he would check behind, it makes 0 sense to check to him unless he is very apt to be bluffing. (which i don't think is very typical in this situation)

unless you can argue that the typical 25nl player is able to fold lower sets and 2 pair hands to the river push getting 3-1, i think its a push.

[Jouster777]

I agree:[ QUOTE ]
checking the river is super bad

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Is anyone getting away from this hand at any point if we do not improve? If so, where?

[Numfar]

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unless you can argue that the typical 25nl player is able to fold lower sets and 2 pair hands to the river push getting 3-1, i think its a push.

[/ QUOTE ]Not so much lower sets but he's not checking them behind either. Folding 2 pair in that spot would be the correct decision (assuming it's J9 or something) because he's not beating anything that the K just helped. However, he doesn't look like a very good player so maybe he'll never fold - I just get the feeling from the turn bet that he's a bit timid.

Anyway, you may be right and it's definitely a push if the Kh drops on the River but the Kd is a big scare card in terms of the flush, straight and a higher 2 pair (if he doesn't have a set). I just feel as though he is checking behind less than he is folding but as I said I don't know how to crunch the numbers.

[rael]

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Is anyone getting away from this hand at any point if we do not improve? If so, where?

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These hands get me in a lot of trouble.

I call the flop raise getting better than 2-1 to see if he bets the turn. Then his turn bet is too small to even consider folding, right? So by the river, even if he pushes you're getting like 3-1, and I'd have a hard time folding an overpair getting 3-1. So I don't know where to let it go. I might find a fold on the river if 10 [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] hits, or maybe even the A [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]. But even then, the pot is so big...

To me, it seems that if villian flopped a set, he played it great and just got really unlucky. If he just had a J or was running a bluff, he played it terribly.

Also, if I knew villian was a good player, I'd have an easier time folding (the river) because villian's line looks like he is trying to suck you in.

Without a read though, this situation blows. KK becomes a bluff catcher in a huge pot.

[PaulG]

Thanks for all the comments. Do you think I should have folded on the flop due to the raise, or is this too weak?

[Numfar]

I agree with a lot of what rael said. You can't get away from it.

If the K doesn't hit the River I may c/f there but even that is difficult give the pot odds - although if it's another diamond then it's more likely that I find a fold.

[Tickner]

Reraise flop, as played C/R or lead turn.