PP 33 speed: AKs postflop donk play

[mmorpg]

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c-bet into 3 players?
I think I c/f this one

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nut no pair and flush draw is like, basically is fine to get ai most times.

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Obviously I am a big nit [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]
I just thought it seemed early for risking the entire stack.

[onlinebeginner]

he prolly has aq or kq so all outs aren't considered good... correct?

[The Vibesman]

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I really don't like making big bets with the nut flush draw. His 1/2 pot was perfect. You want to encourage other flush draws to call, or to CR allin.

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I agree you want other flush draws to call/raise, but don't you think they'll do that anyway? I was also thinking the pot-sized bet looks more like you are trying to protect against a flush draw or take down the pot right there, and hopefully a flush draw would be more likely to push, especially in a speed tourney.

If you did make simply get called for the t240, what's your plan for the rest of the hand? Take a free card in position? call a push in position? Lead OOP? Check OOP (then what?)

[skreemer7]

IMO, hitting an A or K here isn't going to win you this pot. Seems like you'll run into 2 pr. Although at first glance, I am going to put this guy on a pr and a lower flush draw.

[Phil Van Sexton]

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I really don't like making big bets with the nut flush draw. His 1/2 pot was perfect. You want to encourage other flush draws to call, or to CR allin.

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I agree you want other flush draws to call/raise, but don't you think they'll do that anyway? I was also thinking the pot-sized bet looks more like you are trying to protect against a flush draw or take down the pot right there, and hopefully a flush draw would be more likely to push, especially in a speed tourney.



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Many people will call or check-raise anyway, but there are also plenty of people that will change their plan if you bet 30% of your stack.

I suppose a pot sized bet looks like I'm trying to protect a big pair, but I'm not sure that really encourages anyone to push. Donks won't try to push you off a pair because they know that 1 pair is the nuts. Good players obviously don't try to push people off of a big pair in a 33.

I don't see an advantage to betting more, so I'm betting small until I have something more than Ace-high. Maybe a pot sized bet will get TT to fold, but that's hardly worth an extra 240 from my stack.


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If you did make simply get called for the t240, what's your plan for the rest of the hand? Take a free card in position? call a push in position? Lead OOP? Check OOP (then what?)

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With so many people in the hand, you can't really plan for every possibility. Obviously, I'm looking for a free card if I miss the turn. If someone shoves the turn, you have to fold. If they make a smaller bet, we can re-evaluate.

These are valid questions, but I'm not sure how betting bigger on the flop makes any of these decisions easier. If I have to abandon ship on the turn or river, I'll be happy that I saved 240 by only betting 1/2 pot.

[aghasax]

I appreciate all the responses my post got although the discussion took a path I didn’t expect [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

After reading the responses I think I see why the open push play is not preferable. I will only be called by hands I’m an underdog to, locking out draws. Some of the hands they might call me with might be even more susceptible to call when met by my obvious draw (obvious because of the overbet) than a normal-sized bet. If I missed this completely please tell me.

I’m also going to try to summarize why betting is better than checking:

If I check and MP1 pushes, I have to fold. If it checks through and someone push on a blank turn, I have to fold. This way I might have checked myself out of a nice pot.
Whereas if I bet, I might take it down on the flop, or I might get hands I beat to move in or call. This is all good for me except that I might have a hard time playing the rest of the hand OOP if MP calls.

Also if it’s checked through and a diamond hits on turn, I might have more problems getting paid then if I bet the flop?

Again, if I missed this completely I’d appreciate if someone told me.

This is a difficult game [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Phil Van Sexton]

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I appreciate all the responses my post got although the discussion took a path I didn’t expect [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

After reading the responses I think I see why the open push play is not preferable. I will only be called by hands I’m an underdog to, locking out draws. Some of the hands they might call me with might be even more susceptible to call when met by my obvious draw (obvious because of the overbet) than a normal-sized bet. If I missed this completely please tell me.

I’m also going to try to summarize why betting is better than checking:

If I check and MP1 pushes, I have to fold. If it checks through and someone push on a blank turn, I have to fold. This way I might have checked myself out of a nice pot.
Whereas if I bet, I might take it down on the flop, or I might get hands I beat to move in or call. This is all good for me except that I might have a hard time playing the rest of the hand OOP if MP calls.

Also if it’s checked through and a diamond hits on turn, I might have more problems getting paid then if I bet the flop?

Again, if I missed this completely I’d appreciate if someone told me.

This is a difficult game [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

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I wouldn't worry too much about MP shoving the flop or someone shoving the turn if you check. Those are huge overbets that won't happen that often.

I think you should bet because the pot is worth winning now, and you aren't really scared of being called or raised because your hand is so strong. So you bet and hope to fold out crap like 22. A 1/2 pot bet is sufficient for this.

I'd be much more inclined to check if you were the last to act. You really want MP to fold so you have position on the turn/river. This will allow you to check behind on the turn (if you want).