3-street playalong with infinity

[Shillx]

It is possible that everyone who has responded in this thread is incorrect. [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

Possible

Who is in the BB?

[threads13]

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It is possible that everyone who has responded in this thread is incorrect. [img]/images/graemlins/shocked.gif[/img]

Possible

IMO it either goes Fold > Call > 3-bet or Call > Fold > 3-bet. Especially against someone who chases. Weak-tight and now you can 3-bet more freely. It also somewhat depends on the BB though it shouldn't matter unless he is either super aggressive or loose PF-extra tight/passive post. If the BB is loose and really bad I can see no way how calling isn't correct here.

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I understand what you are saying about 3-betting a weak tight.

Can you go a little deeper with the call > fold > 3-bet?

[Aaron W.]

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first question: villain raises utg, all fold to me. I .... ?

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Zeroth question: How many players are at the table?

[BigBadBabar]

...the action continues...

(no relevant reads on BB by the way)

what I was thinking at the time: I don't have a great math sense at all, but my gut feeling was that I was beating about half or a little more than half of his range, with a little dead money in the pot (the BB--not sure if that makes much of an equity difference in limit). On a lot of flops if he doesn't connect decently well I can take it down. Villain is fairly straightforward btw so I think the chance of him putting a big move on me postflop is very low. Plus I have a tight image and figured I'd put it to use.

hero 3bets, 1 fold, UTG calls.

flop 7 2 K rainbow

Hero bets, UTG calls.

turn 2

Hero bets, UTG raises.

What next? And comments/agreements/disagreements/maths/kittens regarding my thoughts?

[BigBadBabar]

Aaron--it's a full-ring table, 10 players.

[Clownfish]

Next...Hero kicks himself for 3 betting OOP instead of throwing his hand in the muck and waiting for a better situation.

With that, if BB is loose enough to call preflop, a call would be better than a raise and play for set value.

As it is, you are OOP in a hand that is at best a very slight favorite. You will likely lose a lot more bets on this when behind than you will win when you are ahead.

[Shillx]

Elementary turn check/fold

[Aaron W.]

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Aaron--it's a full-ring table, 10 players.

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Muckity-muck-muck.

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what I was thinking at the time: I don't have a great math sense at all, but my gut feeling was that I was beating about half or a little more than half of his range, with a little dead money in the pot (the BB--not sure if that makes much of an equity difference in limit).

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Let's put a little math to it. Give an 11 PFR the following UTG hand-raising range: AA-99, AK-AQ, KQs (72 hands = 5.4% PFR). You are 50-50 with this hand range.

To make you a little more than 50-50, we'll throw in the rest of the KQo hands to see how much it affects things (12 more hands, making you ahead of 57% of his hands).

Now consider how much you have to invest to win this pot.

1) 3-bet preflop: 2.5 SB
2) Flop bet: 1 SB
3) Turn bet: 2 SB (You said "On a lot of flops if he doesn't connect decently well I can take it down," but hands like AK will almost always peel one in position so you will sometimes have to bet again -- and you might get raised as you did here and will be forced to fold, which I hope you did)
Total = 3.5 or 5.5 SB

What do you win?

1) BB's money = 1 SB
2) UTG's preflop money = 3 SB
3) UTG's flop money = 1 SB (Sometimes, as discussed above)
Total = 4 SB or 5 SB

So you're getting roughly equal money on your play and the question becomes whether you win more than half the time. It might be possible, but I think it's going to be marginal at best, and devistating under reasonable situations. (For example, villain calls down with KK-JJ when just one overcard falls a decent percent of the time, which means you lose extra money in those spots. Sometimes AK misses the flop, peels, and draws out on the turn... A couple bets here and there and suddenly you're sunk.)

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flop 7 2 K rainbow

Hero bets, UTG calls.

turn 2

Hero bets...

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Why are you betting the turn??

[RemyXO]

This whole hand is spew, so hero 3-bets! Do you fold to cap though? [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

EDIT: How's this for my 300th post, huh?

[OziBattler]

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Elementary turn check/fold

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Shill, please expand a bit on this. I imagine there are a number of people (me included) who may benefit from it. thx