suspicious pokerstars shortstackers data

[RoundTower]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
It seems really odd that they would play all those limits but never 25/50.

[/ QUOTE ]

I haven't mined the 25/50, but I've seen joelmick in it a couple times. I don't think I've seen any of the others.

[/ QUOTE ]
I'm pretty sure I saw coco in a 25-50, also as said I'm pretty sure he didn't use to be a bot.

[shpongled]

I've seen Eva in the 25/50 games, also.

All these players used to be regulars at PLO100 but I haven't seen any of them there since the shortstacking began.

[MadScientist]

How about StaffanMolle?
I hate that [censored]. He does stuff like sit with 4 BB for orbits...

[De Lune]

I don't think these guys are bots I play with them all the time. They all play slightly different with the exception they are all pretty rocky. If they are bots then they are not very good ones I seldom see any of these guys turn a profit.

What I do see a lot of is them loosing their gay little stack and rebuying.

[shpongled]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think these guys are bots I play with them all the time. They all play slightly different with the exception they are all pretty rocky. If they are bots then they are not very good ones I seldom see any of these guys turn a profit.

What I do see a lot of is them loosing their gay little stack and rebuying.

[/ QUOTE ]

I dunno about shortstacking, but they were all winning players at the low stakes when I was playing against them.

I've played enough hands vs. suckoutter and superboydan to think that they aren't bots. Played a ton of hands with Eva and she always seems to play the same.

[omahakid]

I actually sent a email to pokerstars concerning adding tables with just 100bb and also wrote that they should look into these players, yesterday. They never sleeps or they are bots, it is that simple

[Aisthesis]

Yeah, I agree. What I've seen mainly at the 1/2 was that Eva, I thought, was a very good (TAG) player with full stack. I haven't seen her doing very well after she switched to short-stack strategy. For one thing, I think all of these players apply Rolf's ideas (which I actually use occasionally if the table is just right) under circumstances where they're not so great.

Imo, Rolf (in short-stack) works really well if you have a lot of deep stacks at the table and a player to your left with a PFR % of at least 15% and preferably 20% or more. If the loose cannon is to your right, I personally think one is better off attacking him with a full stack or at least one that covers him (cf. Rolf's "isolate with mini-raise deep-stack strategy").

Of the players mentioned here, I feel like Joel has probably done the best job of applying Rolf's short-stack strategy, at least from what I've seen. But I think he overdoes it as well (does it at tables where it really doesn't make a lot of sense).

[Marnixvdb]

pete you are aware that pokerstars is very harsh against datamining, right?

[beset]

Because of the high variance nature of this stuff a lot of people are going to have different estimations of how successfull these folks. I, for example, have superboydan and joelmick as big losers and Eva and Suckouter as insane winners. If you take a step back from the data and actually look at how they play the short-stack I think it is safe to say that they all, with the exception of maybe superboydan who seems to tilt, winning prolly around 3ptb/100 and playing 20 gd hours a day. This is lots of money.

[Aisthesis]

True, but still a far cry from the 30-35 BB/hr. that Rolf was winning in the Vienna game.

Also, I rarely see more than one non-idiotic short-stack in the game (again at 1/2). Short-stacks with no actual strategy, sure.

And one additional thing: All of these players are quite tight. If you're to act after their limp, the rather easy counter-strategy is simply not to raise unless you WANT a pot where they push.

This should at least work until they catch on. Example: You're to the right of whoever with simple full stack and AA. Short-stacker limps. Loose raiser raises. It's easy to call now and have short-stack push, loose raiser probably call... and now you have enough leverage to push your own AA against the other full stack, who normally can't call, and short-stacker is very likely to have KK or some other kind of big card hand that should be a huge underdog to you.