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#42
12-09-2006, 09:50 PM
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Re: Can you beat yourself in a fight...
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] In chess white wins [/ QUOTE ] Just for the record, this is assumed, but not known. It could be that black wins. ~MagicMan [/ QUOTE ] Funny, I always guessed it would be a draw, just based on the large percentage of draws in top level matches. I don't see how a fight to the death can be a draw though...unless my clone and i simultaneously knock each other into a persistent vegatative state... 
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#44
12-09-2006, 11:33 PM
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Re: Can you beat yourself in a fight...
(long time lurker, registered cuz of this thread, incredible forums BTW)
Under the assmption that my clone has my same exact current body condition and exact same brain. There is one advantage that I believe I would have over MY clone: Making him realize that he IS a clone. this may not hold true for everyone, but since we all know how we think, convincing an identical thinker would not be hard. I am pretty sure that if I or my clone realized that I or my clone were a clone, respectively, then I'm pretty sure that I'd be stunned at the moment of realization. While my clone is mentally stunned, I would gain an advantage of pouncing while he is mentally preoccupied. In an assumed identical fighter match, any one advantage, no matter the size, would stand to reason be the determining factor of who would win. This may not work for everyone/thier clone, I am a christian and believe that I have a soul, and also believe that clones do NOT have a soul. I also personally believe that I was created through my 'Higher power's' will. My clone would come into the fight with the same mentality as me.
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#45
12-10-2006, 04:39 AM
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Re: Can you beat yourself in a fight...
[ QUOTE ]
(long time lurker, registered cuz of this thread, incredible forums BTW) Under the assmption that my clone has my same exact current body condition and exact same brain. There is one advantage that I believe I would have over MY clone: Making him realize that he IS a clone. this may not hold true for everyone, but since we all know how we think, convincing an identical thinker would not be hard. I am pretty sure that if I or my clone realized that I or my clone were a clone, respectively, then I'm pretty sure that I'd be stunned at the moment of realization. While my clone is mentally stunned, I would gain an advantage of pouncing while he is mentally preoccupied. In an assumed identical fighter match, any one advantage, no matter the size, would stand to reason be the determining factor of who would win. This may not work for everyone/thier clone, I am a christian and believe that I have a soul, and also believe that clones do NOT have a soul. I also personally believe that I was created through my 'Higher power's' will. My clone would come into the fight with the same mentality as me. [/ QUOTE ] imagine your confusion when, upon seeing you, your clone instantly beings to try and convince you that you're the clone. the real question, is do you have any reason to believe there's a greater than 50% chance you're not actually the clone at that point?
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#46
12-10-2006, 02:28 PM
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Re: Can you beat yourself in a fight...
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] (long time lurker, registered cuz of this thread, incredible forums BTW) Under the assmption that my clone has my same exact current body condition and exact same brain. There is one advantage that I believe I would have over MY clone: Making him realize that he IS a clone. this may not hold true for everyone, but since we all know how we think, convincing an identical thinker would not be hard. I am pretty sure that if I or my clone realized that I or my clone were a clone, respectively, then I'm pretty sure that I'd be stunned at the moment of realization. While my clone is mentally stunned, I would gain an advantage of pouncing while he is mentally preoccupied. In an assumed identical fighter match, any one advantage, no matter the size, would stand to reason be the determining factor of who would win. This may not work for everyone/thier clone, I am a christian and believe that I have a soul, and also believe that clones do NOT have a soul. I also personally believe that I was created through my 'Higher power's' will. My clone would come into the fight with the same mentality as me. [/ QUOTE ] imagine your confusion when, upon seeing you, your clone instantly beings to try and convince you that you're the clone. the real question, is do you have any reason to believe there's a greater than 50% chance you're not actually the clone at that point? [/ QUOTE ] THIS is how this thread should have been from the beginning.
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#47
12-10-2006, 05:12 PM
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Re: Can you beat yourself in a fight...
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] (long time lurker, registered cuz of this thread, incredible forums BTW) Under the assmption that my clone has my same exact current body condition and exact same brain. There is one advantage that I believe I would have over MY clone: Making him realize that he IS a clone. this may not hold true for everyone, but since we all know how we think, convincing an identical thinker would not be hard. I am pretty sure that if I or my clone realized that I or my clone were a clone, respectively, then I'm pretty sure that I'd be stunned at the moment of realization. While my clone is mentally stunned, I would gain an advantage of pouncing while he is mentally preoccupied. In an assumed identical fighter match, any one advantage, no matter the size, would stand to reason be the determining factor of who would win. This may not work for everyone/thier clone, I am a christian and believe that I have a soul, and also believe that clones do NOT have a soul. I also personally believe that I was created through my 'Higher power's' will. My clone would come into the fight with the same mentality as me. [/ QUOTE ] imagine your confusion when, upon seeing you, your clone instantly beings to try and convince you that you're the clone. the real question, is do you have any reason to believe there's a greater than 50% chance you're not actually the clone at that point? [/ QUOTE ]
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#48
12-11-2006, 09:34 AM
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Re: Can you beat yourself in a fight...
Wow...I posted this and completely forgot about it for a week - glad I found it again.
For the question, forget the word clone or any technicalities by which these two fighters are not the same. They are both the same "me" until the moment of the fight. Nobody really addressed the second main question (for me, the more interesting one): Would planning for the fight help either party? Would you 1st, 2nd, 3rd level think ad inifinitum? How about this question: One of the "yous" gets a weapon, say a hunting knife, but he (you) have never been in a knife fight before. He gets no time to prepare. He is held in a suspended state while the other you: Gets no weapon, but is allowed to prepare/practice with the same weapon for a sufficient time (don't be concerned with how long). He is also allowed to strategize.
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#49
12-11-2006, 09:36 AM
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Re: Can you beat yourself in a fight...
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] (long time lurker, registered cuz of this thread, incredible forums BTW) Under the assmption that my clone has my same exact current body condition and exact same brain. There is one advantage that I believe I would have over MY clone: Making him realize that he IS a clone. this may not hold true for everyone, but since we all know how we think, convincing an identical thinker would not be hard. I am pretty sure that if I or my clone realized that I or my clone were a clone, respectively, then I'm pretty sure that I'd be stunned at the moment of realization. While my clone is mentally stunned, I would gain an advantage of pouncing while he is mentally preoccupied. In an assumed identical fighter match, any one advantage, no matter the size, would stand to reason be the determining factor of who would win. This may not work for everyone/thier clone, I am a christian and believe that I have a soul, and also believe that clones do NOT have a soul. I also personally believe that I was created through my 'Higher power's' will. My clone would come into the fight with the same mentality as me. [/ QUOTE ] imagine your confusion when, upon seeing you, your clone instantly beings to try and convince you that you're the clone. the real question, is do you have any reason to believe there's a greater than 50% chance you're not actually the clone at that point? [/ QUOTE ] [/ QUOTE ] Though, this is a great hijack. I wouldn't mind if the thread went in this direction.
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#50
12-11-2006, 03:42 PM
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Re: Can you beat yourself in a fight...
[ QUOTE ]
For the question, forget the word clone or any technicalities by which these two fighters are not the same. They are both the same "me" until the moment of the fight.[ QUOTE ] They can be qualitatively identical, but this poses no special problem when it comes to one or the other of them being able to win the fight. [ QUOTE ] Nobody really addressed the second main question (for me, the more interesting one): Would planning for the fight help either party? Would you 1st, 2nd, 3rd level think ad inifinitum?[ QUOTE ] This question seems to presuppose that there is some special difficulty in one or the other 'twin' being able to win the fight because they are qualitatively identical, and have parallel histories; there isn't, and the question never arises once you understand that fact. [ QUOTE ] How about this question: One of the "yous" gets a weapon, say a hunting knife, but he (you) have never been in a knife fight before. He gets no time to prepare. He is held in a suspended state while the other you: Gets no weapon, but is allowed to prepare/practice with the same weapon for a sufficient time (don't be concerned with how long). He is also allowed to strategize.[ QUOTE ] The answer is, either of them could kill the other with a knife, a gun, or whatever other potentially lethal weapon you might introduce. It's no different than two people with very similar mental and physical abilities fighting one another--something which happens in the real world quite frequently, in fact. I think it is confused to believe that being 'twins' means that there would be some special difficulty with one or the other of them winning the fight. Maybe someone can state what has seemed to remain implicit in many posts here--why do you think there would be a special problem with one or the other person winning the fight? Why would it be in principle especially difficult/impossible for someone to win a fight against someone else who is physically and psychologically similar to them? [/ QUOTE ]
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