Ftp stole my money

[Wetdog]

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In other words: Want to continue sounding like an uneducated [censored]? Just keep hijacking serious conversations with snide remarks about things you don't even understand.

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FYP.

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Wow, are you an ignorant ass. What do I not understand about the "irregardless" argument? It's a word that was introduced into the lexicon by people who mistakenly combined two words to create it. Now, a bunch of dummies from New Jersey run around using it because they think it's correct, not realizing that "regardless" already means "without regard." Get it? It's like "not regarding." That's why the less is there. So please explain to me "what I don't understand," like it's something cryptic.

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Irrelax

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lol grammarnitaments

[otnemem]

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In other words: Want to continue sounding like an uneducated [censored]? Just keep hijacking serious conversations with snide remarks about things you don't even understand.

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FYP.

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Wow, are you an ignorant ass. What do I not understand about the "irregardless" argument? It's a word that was introduced into the lexicon by people who mistakenly combined two words to create it. Now, a bunch of dummies from New Jersey run around using it because they think it's correct, not realizing that "regardless" already means "without regard." Get it? It's like "not regarding." That's why the less is there. So please explain to me "what I don't understand," like it's something cryptic.

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Irrelax

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lol grammarnitaments

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lol thatjokesreallynotthatfunnyanymoreyourealittlelate tothepartyaments.

[sputum]

IROWNED

[Wetdog]

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In other words: Want to continue sounding like an uneducated [censored]? Just keep hijacking serious conversations with snide remarks about things you don't even understand.

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FYP.

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Wow, are you an ignorant ass. What do I not understand about the "irregardless" argument? It's a word that was introduced into the lexicon by people who mistakenly combined two words to create it. Now, a bunch of dummies from New Jersey run around using it because they think it's correct, not realizing that "regardless" already means "without regard." Get it? It's like "not regarding." That's why the less is there. So please explain to me "what I don't understand," like it's something cryptic.

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Irrelax

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lol grammarnitaments

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lol thatjokesreallynotthatfunnyanymoreyourealittlelate tothepartyaments.

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lol ironyaments

[george w]

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In other words: Want to continue sounding like an uneducated [censored]? Just keep hijacking serious conversations with snide remarks about things you don't even understand.

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FYP.

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Wow, are you an ignorant ass. What do I not understand about the "irregardless" argument? It's a word that was introduced into the lexicon by people who mistakenly combined two words to create it. Now, a bunch of dummies from New Jersey run around using it because they think it's correct, not realizing that "regardless" already means "without regard." Get it? It's like "not regarding." That's why the less is there. So please explain to me "what I don't understand," like it's something cryptic.

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jesus

[FTPDoug]

Okay, I believe I've got this sorted out. Here's the timeline as I understand it:

On 9/1 Eric created an account and made a deposit. Over the next 5 days he was the recipient of chip dumping from 7 different accounts, all later confirmed to be involved in credit card fraud. While this chip dumping was going on, he was also playing in legitimate games (and losing the combined fraudulant money). By 9/6 he was broke on this account and was at his current deposit limit, so he created the account he posted about ("rapperson").

Rapperson played for a total of 14 sessions over the span of 4 hours (from about 12:30AM ET until 4:30AM ET on 9/7), against a total of less than 20 players. So for those of you wondering why nobody seems to have any hand histories against this player, this is why. It looks like rapperson was only chip dumped to from one other player who later turned out to be a credit card fraudster. With this ~$8K in cash he went on to play 25/50 NL, 100/200 NL and 25/50 PLO, this time ending up with the slightly under $14K we're talking about.

He then tried to cash out, triggering the investigation.

So that's why his account is locked, his funds seized, and he's most certainly no longer welcome at FTP.

To answer the other issues this case has brought to light:

1. Why did it take from Sept 7th until Nov 2nd (it wasn't 2.5 months as previously thrown around, it was under 2 months) to complete this investigation?
-Credit card fraud and chip dumping can take a long time to verify. We take locking accounts and seizing funds very seriously, and we don't want to come to any snap decisions. That being said, 2 months is still way too long, and our customer support needs better information along the way of an investigation to respond in a timely manner to questions the investigated player may have. We're definitely striving to improve in this area, and with the recent explosion of players we've experienced, growing pains like this are an unfortunate inevitability.

2. Why don't you tell the player when the investigation is complete exactly what they did wrong?
-In 95%+ of the cases, when a player involved in fraud gets caught, they don't need or want an explanation. They understand they've been caught and go back under the rock they came from. What we can do better is that when a player argues vehemently that they're innocent, we should be providing them more details about the case. We will definitely be looking at revising the current policy regarding this.

That being said, it's my belief that Eric here knows what he did, has been lying throughout this thread (sprinkling the truth here and there), and his only motivation is to bad mouth the site that caught him.

I'll try to answer any questions this post might trigger, but understand that since this isn't my area of expertise in the slightest, answers may take a while as I track down someone who can explain this stuff to me.

Doug

[-zero-]

pwned

[Phenomenon]

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pwned

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Exactly what I was thinking. I would like to read his reply to this, if there is one.

[kabz]

Well, I have been following this post from the start and it is the first time something makes sense.
I had some doubts about FTP policies and at some time i started to believe Eric's claims, but now everything is clear. thanks Doug for clearing things up, and restoring our trust in FTP.

Eric, like Doug said, crawl back under some rock

[Bicycles_Biatch]

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Okay, I believe I've got this sorted out. Here's the timeline as I understand it:

On 9/1 Eric created an account and made a deposit. Over the next 5 days he was the recipient of chip dumping from 7 different accounts, all later confirmed to be involved in credit card fraud. While this chip dumping was going on, he was also playing in legitimate games (and losing the combined fraudulant money ). By 9/6 he was broke on this account and was at his current deposit limit, so he created the account he posted about ("rapperson").

Rapperson played for a total of 14 sessions over the span of 4 hours (from about 12:30AM ET until 4:30AM ET on 9/7), against a total of less than 20 players. So for those of you wondering why nobody seems to have any hand histories against this player, this is why. It looks like rapperson was only chip dumped to from one other player who later turned out to be a credit card fraudster. With this ~$8K in cash he went on to play 25/50 NL, 100/200 NL and 25/50 PLO, this time ending up with the slightly under $14K we're talking about.

He then tried to cash out, triggering the investigation.



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So let me get this straight... the money he "apparently" received from chip dumpers he immediately lost back to legit players in the FTP network.

However... when he went on a rush and won a legit $14K... he was banned?

Based on your explanation I'm concerned about several things...

1) Why wasn't he recognized as a cheater when he was actually recieving "confirmed" stolen funds???

2) Why wait for him to withdraw money before doing and investigation???

3) Why allow him to open a 2nd account to begin with if you had proof that his first account was conducting fraud???

4) Doesn't this chain of events show Eric to be more of a un-suspecting moron... not a colluding genius??? I mean, he LOST the money that was dumped to him.

5) I'm VERY CONCERNED that FTP doesn't really care about the safety of their games or their honest customers UNTIL money is exiting their site. As an outsider looking in... this really sucks.

Basically FTP is saying that you can collude, chip dump, cheat honest players... and then when you go to cash out... we are going to confiscate your money.

Overall, I think maybe FTP doesn't truly have a grasp on how many Cheaters and Credit Card fraud players are out there just to gamble it up and play poker on someone elses dime.

I'm think it's possible (maybe not likely)... but definately possible that Eric Jones got screwed.