Bankroll Management

[cbayly12]

Hey everyone,

I am new to this forum and have been playing poker regularly for about 2.5 years now. I find myself crossing the same situations over and over again. I don't make large deposits or deposit often, but I have built a bankroll 4 times and busted each time (trying higher limits to early). I turn a 50 dollar deposit into about $2000 (usually from a MTT win), and try my luck in higher limit cash games). I play NL and I can beat the $1/$2 game and find myself becoming impatient with the slow bankroll building.

My question is this. If I play NL what kind of bankroll should I have for each limit?? I've frequently heard 20-25 buyins, but is that the truth? And if I do abide by these rules, then how much should I expect to earn/hour at each limit playing NL?

Also I track my stats and I believe I am a better MTT player. Even though the long runs of no big wins can get frustrating, what kind of bankroll should I have to play in these bigger tourneys? And how much should I expect to earn/hour playing in tourney?

If anyone could help I would appreciate it.

Thanks

[Adam Selene]

Haven't investigated backroll management at all, but playing lately I have decided that I would never have more than 10% of my bankroll in play, and never less than 5%. If less than 5%, move up stakes or cash out part of the bankroll, if more than 10%, drop to lower stakes.

Has worked great so far.

[Mythra]

tons of posts regarding this matter, search.

[gull]

It depends.

(variance)^2 / (2*winrate) * ln(risk of ruin) = (bankroll)

[wazz]

[ QUOTE ]
It depends.

(variance)^2 / (2*winrate) * ln(risk of ruin) = (bankroll)

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm having difficulty with a couple of the words in your post, could I get a technical definition?

ln

ruin

bankroll

depends.

Plz don't tramble down.

[GREEKTOWNFOX]

I cannot speak well of trnys but I never buy into an online cash game with over 5% of my bankroll. I also pack up from the table should i end up with an amout over 10% in a gameing room.

[AaronBrown]

It sounds to me as if the problem isn't bankroll management, but not adapting to the higher stakes games. It takes one set of skills to grind out a profit at $1/$2, a different set to beat $10/$20.

Every poker game has winners and losers. At $1/$2 there is a nearly unlimited supply of new losers, and lots of people who can afford to lose big for years and pay for it out of entertainment budget.

At $10/$20 that's not as true. Sure, a few people start their on-line poker at those stakes, drop a few thousand dollars, and disappear; but not as many as $1/$2 first-timers who drop a few hundred dollars. Yes, there are some people who can lose $1,000 a month playing $10/$20 and not feel it, but not as many as can lose $100 a month at $1/$2.

On the other side, a good multitabling $1/$2 player is making a wage the same order of magnitude as the legal minimum wage; and taking a lot more risk to do it. A good $10/$20 player can actually support himself. So the incentive for a good player is much higher.

Playing with lots of losers and few really good players is a different matter than playing with only a few losers and lots of really good players. An important source of income for the $10/$20 game is $1/$2 players who move up without noticing the differences. In some ways, the game is almost optimized to take this money. The $1/$2 game is much more likely to take the money of naive loose-passive players.

[pzhon]

[ QUOTE ]
It sounds to me as if the problem isn't bankroll management, but not adapting to the higher stakes games.

[/ QUOTE ]
I agree that the OP is overlooking the skills needed to win. A bankroll does not convert a losing player to a winning player. A solid winner should make more in one month than the OP has made in years of playing.

[ QUOTE ]

On the other side, a good multitabling $1/$2 player is making a wage the same order of magnitude as the legal minimum wage; and taking a lot more risk to do it.


[/ QUOTE ]
This is pretty misleading. The OP was talking about NL, not limit. Even for limit, a good multitabler can easily make over $15/hour at $1-$2, and might make over twice that. While these are less than 10 times the minimum wage, these are substantial, and are comparable with the median wage. A good NL $200 multitabler can make much more, of course.

The more important amount is what a losing player will lose. Losing players don't multitable nearly as much as winning players do. Typical bad player lose less per hour by playing $1-$2 than they do at many other recreational activities, so there is little incentive for typical bad players to get better. Bad players at higher stakes tend to care more about the money they lose, although there are plenty of people who still don't care about larger amounts.

[ QUOTE ]
An important source of income for the $10/$20 game is $1/$2 players who move up without noticing the differences.

[/ QUOTE ]
I doubt most losers at $10-$20 ever took $1-$2 seriously. Money doesn't flow much between levels. Losing players deposit, and usually play at their level until it is gone.

[dreilly]

you should have 300x the bb to sit down at a LIMIT table and that should be 5-10% of your bankroll, if you dont follow this you run the risk of going broke

[AaronBrown]

Okay, I stand corrected.

But I don't think you disagree that the texture of the games is different for a lot of reasons. If a player is consistently winning at one level and losing at another, it's probably not bankroll management.