Here we go...

[tolbiny]

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This is false. If the money gets shifted from a sector with a low velocity to a sector with a higher velocity (which min wage laws do), it will result in total overall growth.

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Please calrify what you mean by high anad low velocity sectors.


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You're right. That's why the heliocentric theory is true and no amount of telescopic observations can discredit it.

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If your telescope is set on a boat the sises and falls with the waves wouldyou consider those measurments to be accurate if the didn't take into acocunt the motion of the waves?

[peritonlogon]

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The problem with this is that the way retirement funds and mutual funds are set up, they do not benefit by performing well and cheaply, this is because the executives and managers get to take a big cut that they would not ever want to give up, especially since, the methods for attaining customers is through either advertising or social networking, ie, getting the contract with an employer. This method creates a market where the best services don't win out. The information is too asymetrical

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we're at the edge (or over as i may soon demonstrate) of my knowledge on the issue- but its my understanding that the gov decides who is eligible as a company to provide 401k plans and the like. Basically the only way that CEOs can direct the market in a way they like is with the aid of gov regulations, otherwise alternates should appear. I'm not quite sure what you mean by asymetrical information (perhaps you mean the varience in the market making it hard to build a solid reputation. There are definately ways around this, including the authors plan of using bons essentially to fund the growth of the plan).


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Informational asymetry is what happens when one party or group of people interacting, say, customers, have less information than the other party or group (we, as poker players rely on this...kind of). This is what allowed, for years, travel agents, airlines and insurance companies, to name a few, to make seriously bloated profits. Thankfully the internet did away with those by making the information between buyers and sellers more symetrical. The information held by financial planners and salesmen of 401(k)s is pretty asymetric to your common guy looking to save for his retirement. What follows may be crossing the line from Gov retirement plans into just investing, but, there is a lot of overlapping. A fee-only financial advisor is the only type of financial advisor legally required to give you honest advice. If a financial advisor is paid by commissions only or fee/commissions he or she is not obligated to give you sound advice. This is not something commonly known, (asymetric information) a person sits down with an advisor, think's they're getting good information, but, really they're just talking to a salesman who wants to make as many transactions at the highest possible rate (that maintains his clients). This is the state of a lot of the 410(k)s where the employer offers dozens of options (none of which are really good) or they get one through their bank in some sort of a bundle deal.

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I doubt the capped government wages will be able to compete in bringing in top talent to analyze these situations. I would guess the gov would lag behind signifigantly and the whole program would not be overly popular.

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One of the propositions is various types of index funds, I think, which are usually the best way to go if you're not looking to manage something closely, in that case, a gov run index fund would have a huge edge because of it's salary capps.

[Barfunkel]

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If "they" really "want monies", why don't "they" work smarter, longer, harder, faster?


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Because they work at McDonalds?

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LOL, haven't been there for years and am thankfully no expert, but even in that crowd, I am guessing that an above average worker can be rewarded and promoted.

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I don't know about the US of A but in Finland the ones who work hard, never get sick and so on never get promoted. Good workers are hard to find, so they don't want to waste their talents. If you want to get promoted you leave your job, go to school and come back with the more education.

Actually, in one of my previous jobs 2 of my bosses actually got promoted because they were such bad workers. One of them was constantly breaking things (one year he broke stuff worth 100.000 total, to the amusement of the maintenance crew), one of them was always hiding from work and when he did work he did it badly. So obviously the company promoted them, they'd be less a nuisance as bosses. And I always work my ass off, do stuff I'm not even supposed to and all they say is that they can't give me a raise because it's the company policy. A crazy world...

[BCPVP]

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So obviously the company promoted them, they'd be less a nuisance as bosses.

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I'd guess there are restrictions on firing people in Finland.

[Chromis]

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Nevermind that the majority of people who work minimum wage are teens who live at home.

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Where are you getting this from? This ultra-left wing think tank seems to have conflicting statistics:

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Minimum wage workers tend to be young. About half of workers earning $5.15 or less were under age 25, and about one-fourth of workers earning at or below the minimum wage were age 16-19. Among employed teenagers, about 9 percent earned $5.15 or less. About 2 percent of workers age 25 and over earned the minimum wage or less. Among those age 65 and over, the proportion was about 3 percent. (See table 1 and table 7.)

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I'm really not sure who to believe on this one.

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How many of those adult "minimum wage" workers are actually waitstaff, etc. whose pay including tips is far above the average wage?

[Barcalounger]

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Nevermind that the majority of people who work minimum wage are teens who live at home.

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Where are you getting this from? This ultra-left wing think tank seems to have conflicting statistics:

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Minimum wage workers tend to be young. About half of workers earning $5.15 or less were under age 25, and about one-fourth of workers earning at or below the minimum wage were age 16-19. Among employed teenagers, about 9 percent earned $5.15 or less. About 2 percent of workers age 25 and over earned the minimum wage or less. Among those age 65 and over, the proportion was about 3 percent. (See table 1 and table 7.)

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I'm really not sure who to believe on this one.

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How many of those adult "minimum wage" workers are actually waitstaff, etc. whose pay including tips is far above the average wage?

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I think that in most places that waitstaff can actually make less than minimum wage in base pay.

[Chromis]

I understand this. But there is a minimum that they must be paid, and I'm wondering if these folks are included in the percentages quoted.

[Barcalounger]

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I understand this. But there is a minimum that they must be paid, and I'm wondering if these folks are included in the percentages quoted.

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It looks to me like the buereau of labor statistics defines a minimum wage earner as someone making $5.15 or below an hour. I guess that would mean that waitstaff was probably included in the numbers.

http://www.bls.gov/cps/minwage2002.htm