KK UTG with Raise and Cold Call Behind Me on flop

[PBJaxx]

[ QUOTE ]
you screwed up at just about every opportunity. can't wait for you to be be at my table...
here fishy fishy!!

[/ QUOTE ]

I put the over/under on goat's age at 15.

-Jaxx

[delta k]

shove this holmes

[Fishlips_Jones]

I think posting results are more OK in NL simply to confirm reads. I put one of 'em on a 7[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] and the other on a pocket pair 10's - Q's, also with a [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]

How did this hand end up?

[bilbo-san]

Easy push.

The minraiser often has a draw or even just a pair + OESD.

The smooth-caller rarely has a set. Why would he let the minraiser (and you) draw for cheap?

You are probably 50/50 to win this pot, but the pot size is giving you a huge overlay. Push!

Also, bet more on this drawy flop. $14+.

The player telling you to raise more preflop and call + push turn is an idiot. Raising more when you have a good hand and less when you don't is pretty terrible advice, and calling when you are probably 50/50 or better (but will HATE HATE HATE a lot of turn cards) is even worse.

[llleisure]

You definitely can't call there - you either fold or push. I'd have pushed and I would be worried more about the BB call of the $22 more than the CO.

SO many times when I am in this situation the guy that min-raises you is just doing it to give himself better odds to call your turn bet when his draw doesn't hit. My reply is usually "it'll be all your money now to see if your draw hits" and sometimes he has a set. That part is read dependent and with two people, one calling two bets, it becomes scary.

As far as what they had, at least one of them had to be on a draw to a straight/flush/either or. The other probably had either top pair and was an idiot or had hit a set (or two pair 8/9 maybe) and still somewhat of an idiot. If the CO has a set/2pair already, why on earth doesn't HE push here to make draws expensive? If the BB has a set, the min-raise seems wrong because it may not get rid of draws. It really doesn't make sense to me that either has a set or if they do, the play seems whacky.

Could be that the BB expected the min-raise to get rid of the CO and he was comfortable he had you beat with set or two pair and not worried about the draws - that might actually fit. When CO doesn't fold and you do, it hoses BB's plan though. In this case, the min raise was trying to induce you to push and you didn't so good job! [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]