Call down w/ 3rd pair after a steal?

[chopchoi]

$3/6. I stole BB's blind last round when 3 clubs flopped.

I'm button with A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 7 [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]. It folds to me, I raise, button calls.

Flop: Q, 8, 7 rainbow. BB check/raises, I call.
Turn: 2. He bets. Can I give him credit for a hand, or should I call down, figuring his bet simply means "You're not gonna get away with that twice."

P.S. this is why I hate stealing. I feel like I'm wearing a sign that says "Please check-raise me!" Even the tightest players get LAGgy when a player in LP open-raises, and you never know where you're at. Yesterday I saw the BB, who is usually fairly tight, check raise a theif with a K7o that totally missed the flop, and then bluff the turn and river. The CO called down with pocket 3's and took the pot.

[XmasXmas]

i would call down. if nothing else, it shows your legitimacy. A7s is a fine hand to be opening with in LP. the instant i see someone show down T3s on a steal attempt, i make a note to make all their future steal attempts difficult (and it will be if they're stealing w/ crap like that).

[mrcunningham]

you have bottom pair with best kicker. he doesn't know that you actually stole the last round, nor does he know that you were stealing this time. You just think he thinks that. This seems like a WA/WB situation. They didn't raise preflop, so they either have paired with the board, nothing, or they have a OESD or ISD, but they don't have the odds to call value raise or bet either of these. Probably I call turn, and B/F river.

[phosix]

id either fold or raise for free showdown.
if he 3 bets you can fold, but he probably isnt strong enough to 3 bet. if you improve on river you can get an extra bet in.

you also can get him to possibly fold an 8 here with the raise

[chopchoi]

I like it.

[goofball]

He's not folding an 8 and if he's getting frisky there's a small chance he plays back at us. Just call down.

[Allday Everyday]

I would definately call down here.

If I have stolen from the same blinds in the last few orbits, I always tighten up a bit. However A7s is a legitimate hand to open raise from the button. I'd raise preflop every time.

I think you're ahead enough of the time against a 3/6 unknown to make the call down profitable. Futhermore, like XmasXmas has said, when you get it to showdown it shows you're stealing with a good hand. It should make future blind stealing against these opponents a little easier. Obviously raise the river if you hit a seven or an ace.

[phosix]

[ QUOTE ]
He's not folding an 8 and if he's getting frisky there's a small chance he plays back at us. Just call down.

[/ QUOTE ]

i maybe theres a very small chance that he will
and if there is low possiblity of a 3 bet id say raise. Calling down is very weak line. "it says hey im a puss, now do me" the call down is fine but id like to ram it up and confuse my opponent.
tell me why the raise isnt better

[Allday Everyday]

[ QUOTE ]
id either fold or raise for free showdown.
if he 3 bets you can fold, but he probably isnt strong enough to 3 bet. if you improve on river you can get an extra bet in.

you also can get him to possibly fold an 8 here with the raise

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't think I like the raise-fold turn play here against an unknown. In my experience at small stakes, very few opponents will fold a better hand in this blind steal situation. Unless you know the opponent to be one of these players, I wouldn't raise here.

Also, by raising you give the blind a chance to 'outplay' you by reraising you with a worse hand. I've seen this many times from both decent and non-decent players. I think play can get a little crazy in blind steal situations.

Also, by raising your opponent may fold a worse holding. I don't think we want this here. He may have planned to bet again at the river.

By calling down, I think you still get that extra bet in if you improve on the river. That is, if your opponent bets again at the river. You won't usually have to raise the turn for the free showdown to get the extra bet in if you improve at the river.

This seems like an excellent spot to call down and raise if you improve.

[JJH3984]

[ QUOTE ]
Calling down is very weak line. "it says hey im a puss, now do me" the call down is fine but id like to ram it up and confuse my opponent.
tell me why the raise isnt better

[/ QUOTE ]

Calling down is the best line. Think about the hands that villian can have here on this drawless board. Any Q, any 8, any 7, air a fair portion of the time. I think its pretty clear we have enough equity to SD. From my experience, he isn't folding a hand we beat enough to raise for fold equity. Anything he does fold, we probably didn't want him to. Better to gain an extra bet when he is bluffing IMO. This seems like a classic "play defense" situation to me.