a rock question (show me how smart you are)

[Nick Royale]

How many hands do you usually play from UTG? Let's say 15%. You get the full value from these. How often will you actually see a flop? Maybe around 35% (I really don't know how aggressive this game is). You don't get any value from the hands you fold (unless it's in a spot where you would have limp/folded without the rock). Sometimes you'll call on the rock with a really small edge, so my guess is a little closer to 15 than 35. Around 20-25% the value of the rock.

[Lestat]

If I had the rock, I'd sell it to you for $150 for sure. Maybe less. I haven't done the numbers, but that's my guess.

[Lestat]

Guys, I think what he's asking is this:

You have the rock, which means you'll have to post $200 next time you're UTG. How much would you be willing to sell the rock for? Certainly if someone offers you $195 for it, you should jump at the chance to sell it. Personally, I'd take $150 for it (i.e. I'd give you the $200 rock in my posession for $150, and let YOU post the rock on your next turn).

So by figuring out the minimum price that should be accepted for rock, is what the rock is worth. Am I understanding you correctly, OP?

[PokerBot123]

Forget between 80 and 90% I was thinking shorthanded. Its value is about 60-70% at a 9 handed table.

Meaning you should probably sell it if somebody offers you <$135

[tpir]

Since you have to post it and won't take it with you... the extra action it may generate will be less valuable to us being OOP, yes?

I would think it's worth around $0.00 unless I am misunderstanding the problem.

[mike l.]

thanks for clarifying and i agree with your assessment.

[UprightCreature]

[ QUOTE ]

how much is a rock worth?


[/ QUOTE ]

I started to write up a response with a detailed answer, but it turns out to be more complicated than I thought at first. The value of the rock is $200 + EV of Stradeling plus a further correction because the rock is part of that pot. I have to think about it some more, but it certainly depends on game conditions. I think it will be pretty close to $200 + 2 * EV of being in the big blind.

[stinkypete]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

how much is a rock worth?


[/ QUOTE ]

I started to write up a response with a detailed answer, but it turns out to be more complicated than I thought at first. The value of the rock is $200 + EV of Stradeling plus a further correction because the rock is part of that pot. I have to think about it some more, but it certainly depends on game conditions. I think it will be pretty close to $200 + 2 * EV of being in the big blind.

[/ QUOTE ]

i think you're on the right track here, but i also think the "correction because the rock is part of that pot" is bigger than you think.

here's something to think about:

you probably lose about 0.2-0.25BB/hands posting $100 in the big blind.

how much do you lose when you're posting a rock? the rock itself is worth considerably less than $200, so you're not posting $200. let's assume you lose about the same percentage of your post as you would in the big blind, so about 40% of the of the rock.

based on those assumptions (feel free to modify them as you see fit), how would you go about determining the value of a rock?

[DpR]

The way to answer the question is to take the difference between your EV UTG assuming you don't straddle (maybe 0.06BB) and your EV UTG when you do straddle with the rock. The second EV is pretty hard to determine, but it is you EV as if you were allowed to play in the pot without putting in the first 2 small bets preflop. (The rock is being returned to the person that made it after the gaem is over).

The amount is clearly less than $200 since you cannot be selective with your hand. I would guess that the rock is worth around $50 AT MOST. I think these figures over $100 are not even close.

[danzasmack]

This is a cool, new concept to me. If someone wins the pot with the rock in it, does that person have to post the rock again as well?