NL 25 OOP lost on turn

sean c · #1 09-21-2006, 10:55 AM

Noob here in need of help. I think i got this right up until the turn if i didn't please let me know.

PP $25 6 max.

EP limper($15 or so) - is completely retarded.
CO sean c ($20) - close to completely retarded
Button ($50+) - seems to be aggressive and good.

Pre flop: EP limps, folds to me i raise to a $1.25 with A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], button calls, blinds fold and ep limper calls.

Flop ($4.10): A [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]9 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]8 [img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
EP checks, i bet $4, button calls and EP folds.

Turn($12.10): 3 [img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]
I have no idea how much to bet or what to do?

Does my flop play suck?

Charousek · #2 09-21-2006, 11:35 AM

I think the Flop Bet is ok, you have to find out right away what`s going on. If you would check here, maybe the Button would bet or EP would bet the Turn, but you would not get any good information from that.
I think bet 4 on the Flop is good. If the Button really is a good player, then his Flopcall is very strong, because he has to realize that he is sandwiched between you and a player who still is in the hand and can call or raise or even push. So after your potsized bet, in my eyes it is unlike he`s on just a flushdraw.
After firing another shot on the Turn you are not able to fold anymore, so check and see what happens. If he comes out with a big bet here, it is not unlikely you are beat.

Of course it is possible that the Button knows what a fish EP is and called the Flop with just a flushdraw, expecting EP to call anyway and giving him good Pot odds.
That would also explain why he didnt raise the Flop for protection. Not easy without stats.

Shaddux · #3 09-21-2006, 12:33 PM

Flop is fine.
Betting here basically commits you. I probably c/c and put villain on a lower ace. He's probably checking behind with a draw and might bet river if checked to. This line probably loses a lot of value, but I hate being OOP in a bloated pot.

nyc999 · #4 09-21-2006, 01:07 PM

Tough situation.

I think I prefer a bet on the turn to a c/c. If you check, an aggressive villain is betting almost anything (including the weaker ace and flush/st8 draws). If you call, you're going to have to commit the rest of your stack on the river. Therefore, I prefer to bet $8-$9 on the turn.

One question - has this aggressive villain been calling flop bets in position? If he's as good as you say, he may be trying to take away the pot on this scary board.

sean c · #5 09-21-2006, 01:21 PM

[ QUOTE ]

One question - has this aggressive villain been calling flop bets in position? If he's as good as you say, he may be trying to take away the pot on this scary board.

[/ QUOTE ]

This was the first hand i had seen him play where he was not the aggressor. The table was pretty loose/passive in general. When he called the flop i assumed right or wrong that he was either drawing, crushing me or going to make a play on the pot. I assume if you bet $8 or $9 you are committing your stack? Being a limit donk i never really consideed checking this turn at the time.

Spy Dog · #6 09-21-2006, 01:37 PM

CRAI. Villian will bluff a flush draw and also value bet a worse Ace.

IceMuncher · #7 09-21-2006, 02:01 PM

[ QUOTE ]
CRAI. Villian will bluff a flush draw and also value bet a worse Ace.

[/ QUOTE ]
At first I didn't see it, but then looked at the chip stack and the size of the pot, and this looks like the best move to me.