5 most important post-flop observations about low-limit players

[Wynton]

This list is meant for people who are relatively new to six-max and playing 5/10 and lower, so experienced people out there try to resist the inevitable urge for sarcasm. Better yet, tell me if your list would be different.

So, without further undue, here are the 5 observations I think low-limit six-max players should make a particular effort to notice about unknown opponents as quickly as possible:

1. Do they c/r the flop on draws?
2. When they donk at the river, does it mean a real hand, a weak hand or air?
3. Do they fast-play or slow-play very strong hands on the flop?
4. Do they habitually pay one bet to see the turn, then fold without help?
5. Can they be induced to bluff at the river, if their opponent checks?

[milesdyson]

4 & 5 are important. 2 & 3 are fairly specific and may not necessarily be completely reliable.

you also would like to know if they will bluff bet when checked to in small 2 or 3-way pots.

[billygrippo]

w/o further undue?

[Wynton]

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w/o further undue?

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Just testing to see if anyone actually reads these posts.

[img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]

[SparkyDog]

A really, really, important one is if they bluff raise on the big streets and keep up the pressure, in position and out.

i'd rephrase number 5, as it implies that it's good if opponents will bluff the river after a turn check thru. i'd much prefer they didn't.

<edit> i like to know their position betting standards, since a lot of these guys will autobet flops if they're last to act, and this is a good way to protect your hand/rebluff </edit>

[Wynton]

Hey Miles, you really don't think it's important to notice what a river donk bet means? I think that's key. Also, my observation is that the donk-bettors usually fall either into the bluff or made hand category pretty clearly.

[Buzz-cp]

theese are mostly read dependant, but if we were to generitize them, I'd say...

1. nope, they donk them
2. very read dependent, but usually donking with a busted draw, as they have no balws to c/r.
3. slowplay iz teh shiznit. I love to see the slowplayed top pair. I have seen many just call with top 2 to the river
4. it's no fold'em, and as such..
5. sometimes, like if it's raining out

[RunDownHouse]

I would modify #2 to: What do their donks generally mean on any street?

If I'm remembering correctly, you don't get nearly as many river donks at the lower limits as you do in higher games. By then the villian is usually cowed into submission.

I would remove #3 entirely, because I think the villian that fastplays a big hand on the flop is pretty rare, such that when it does happen, it creates an immediate impression. Its not something one needs to work at observing. Maybe that's just me, though.

I would replace #3 with something like, "What do they bet with when checked to?" Some players will check behind flush draws, others will bet with air. That may be a little broad, but its generally getting at how likely they are to take shots at a pot when everyone shows weakness, and with which hands are they willing to do so.

[SparkyDog]

yeah, it's v. important.

i don't know how many times i've been pinned because i don't know if a river donk means a weak made hand that will still pay off a raise, a weak made hand that won't, a very stron hand looking to 3bet, or complete air.

[jd_poker]

Knowing if they bluff in small pots is crucial.
Also, knowing if they will call-down to with any piece is good too.