QQ UTG

DeeJ · #1 01-26-2006, 06:16 AM

MTT with 18 places paying, I'm about 20th with 7k chips, blinds are 200/400 with ante (25? 50?)

So I have QQ UTG. I raise to 1600 leaving me with 5400 chips. Tightish MP player who has 11k chips raises me to 3200 chips.

I decide not to push as he has me covered, I call (leaving me with 3800) and see a yuck AK7 flop.

Check, he min-bets. What's the plan?

Exitonly · #2 01-26-2006, 06:22 AM

theres no way i'm just calling PF.. but i guess now that you're here.. just fold it. The only reason to call PF is so you can get away from these flops.

Skjonne · #3 01-26-2006, 06:46 AM

Preflop: I'M ALL-IN BABY!!~!~!!

If there's any reason for just calling, it's so you can get away from a flop like this. So given your pre-flop play, this is an easy, easy fold.

An important point of playing a poker hand is to have a plan. Everytime you do something other than fold, you need to know why you did that and what you're doing if this and that happends.

Since you posted this hand at this particular point I guess you didn't have a plan. Flat calling preflop because "he has you covered" is bad. That's not a valid reason. Flat calling preflop because you'll lay down to overcards is fine (allthough weak-tight)

Killmark · #4 01-26-2006, 07:42 AM

You should have pushed the flop... you most likely had the best hand PF and you would not be faced with this kind of decision.

Now it's time to fold. The mini-raise & mini-bet might actually mean he has AA/KK, so you might have gotten lucky this time.

DeeJ · #5 01-26-2006, 07:49 AM

The plan was that I could get away from a nasty flop, since a reraise from a solid player against me who was not short-stacked, had been playing tight and was facing my UTG bet was almost certainly going to contain an Ace or King. I nearly pushed pf but figured I would likely only get called by AA/KK/AK given my position and "decent but not great" stack.

So that is what I did, folded the flop and survived. I didn't simply call pf just because he had me covered, I did so because the combined likelihood of him having AK/KK/AA plus him having me covered gave me more options. But I'm interested to hear you simply push here! [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

edit: the reason i posted this particular point was whether there is a sufficiently big enough chance that he will min-bet with 99/TT/JJ just to scare me off if I don't have the Ace.

Killmark · #6 01-26-2006, 07:52 AM

Didn't see the bubble situation, that changes things a bit. But if you want to be able to get away, rather raise 3x blind that 4x.

flytrap · #7 01-26-2006, 07:55 AM

I don't think the reraiser is ever going to fold preflop. He would call with any two after making it almost half your stack size. I think if you're going to play you need to get it in preflop. What if the flop has only an ace, or only a king, are you going to check fold? He could have AQ, JJ, TT, etc. Getting it in preflop means you get to see all 5 cards with what may very well be the best hand, and you won't get outplayed later by letting him take control of the hand.

DeeJ · #8 01-26-2006, 08:11 AM

Just an Ace as overcard and I will push because my odds are better (that he hasn't hit) eg if it's A84 and he's got Kings, he'll more than likely fold to my push since it would hit him for 2/3 of his stack if he called and saw AK/AQ.
If there's a King overcard it's less helpful because he's not folding AK or AA or KK, but he's beating me about 66% with those anyway had we gone all-in pf.

But pushing pf avoids me making any difficult decisions, which is usually a reasonable route [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img] (always learning)

nath · #9 01-26-2006, 04:24 PM

[ QUOTE ]
The plan was that I could get away from a nasty flop, since a reraise from a solid player against me who was not short-stacked, had been playing tight and was facing my UTG bet was almost certainly going to contain an Ace or King.

[/ QUOTE ]

Why? Couldn't it easily be JJ/TT?
Here's the deal: You've invested over 20% of your stack on your initial raise with the third-best hand. When you're reraised, you've put in almost half your stack. You should NOT be looking to "get away" from this hand. You should be looking to put all your chips in and hope your hand is good enough to double you up.
If you bust or run into AA/KK, that sucks, sure. But YOU CAN'T PASS UP THESE OPPORTUNITIES IN MTTS. You can't put in half your stack with a premium hand and then look for an excuse to fold!
Scared poker doesn't win tournaments.