My comments on WSEX's latest update and the missing names in the HH's

[Terry]

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you were being a bit dramatic

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That was my objective, to dramatically illustrate the effects of massive multi-tabling by use of extreme examples.

I think showing the effect of reducing the house take, while not a particularly dramatic amount (less than 10% even with my extreme examples), should put to rest the argument that high volume players pay more rake. If you are a winning player, you are paying them nothing – you are taking money from the house that they would have earned as rake.

(I will give a nod here to the idea that winning players are tolerated because they build the core player base to start the games. There are even situations where prop players and such are useful. That is a different story.)

What is dramatic is the speed with which the live ones go broke and the word of mouth they pass on to their friends and acquaintances when the poker room is filled by TAG “strip mining” multi-tablers. The difference between the live ones having some fun for several playing sessions and of busting out in an hour is dramatic. That is bad for poker. Very bad.

[William]

HUD's are here to atay, true, but they are not at WPEX, that's what this thread is about.

[jb9]

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ADAPT OR DIE.

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Players adapt to HUDs or die?
or
Sites adapt to stopping HUDs or die?

A reputation for being "full of unbeatable sharks using fish finding software" is not going to promote the future of any site.

FWIW, I'm in the "I use them but wouldn't shed a tear if they disappeared" camp when it comes to HUDs.

[lotus guardian]

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This entire debate is stupid because HUD's are here and aren't going anywhere.

We might as well argue about whether gravity is a good or bad thing. Does it matter? It's here and not going anywhere.

For better or worse, HUD's are here and here to stay. ADAPT OR MOVE TO WSEX .

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FYP

[4thstreetpete]

I think some of you are missing the point. Classifying someone as anti-hud because they don't know how to use these programs properly is ludicrous. Obviously every 2+2er knows the benefit of using Huds and PT and are in fact using it. Not doing so would put you at an extreme disadvantage.

WSEX GM's decision is not unique, some sites do frown upon using these tools because they think it would be better for their room in the end. In the current issue of pokerpro, there was an article by the author on a day of being a poker professional. He stated one of the first things he did before playing was turning off pokertracker because he would've had it datamining all night. He would restart it so it's fresh and load up stats on his opponents online and fire up PAHUD.
Now I have talked to many people who don't like to play online because no matter how much you try to convince them they are still hesitant to play simply because they are not so tech savy and worried about being cheated online. Imagine the novice player who reads this article and finds out people turn their computer on all night datamining their opponents. These new players would be less likely to sink their feet into the world of online poker.

Am I against PT and PAHUD? no because I do see it;s value. However I'm not opposed to sites not allowing it either. If they were eliminated completely I wouldn't be too bent out of shape about it. I was a winning player pre PT and HUDs and will continue to be. Obviously now that online poker has changed so much there's no going back.

For a game that has been so good to me, I would like to see it grow. I see that WSEX GM agrees with me too and I think it's a positive move. No one is attacking PAHUD and Josh's integrity. In a forum like this we have people of all different age/race/sex groups who are not always going to have the same opinions.