so let me get this new WPEX thing straight

[MNpoker]

[ QUOTE ]
Wait, I thought the automated HH's on WPEX were not compatible with PT yet.
So you really CAN use it with PT??


Also - Pokerace, I disagree that the stats in a single-session can't be meaningful.
If somebody had 40 hands and is playing 40/10 then there are two possibilities:
- He is playing more hands than he should
- He got a good run of limp-able cards over that stretch

I really think the first is far more likely even with such a small sample as 40 hands in 1 session.


Same goes for somebody who is 15/1 after 40 hands. They are clearly not aggressive enough and there is a good chance they can be pushed around.


Yes, sometimes the stats can be deceiving in such a short-sample for one reason or another.
But, in my experience, a player who is 40/10 after 40 hands will have similarly crappys stats after 400 hands and after 4k hands.


VP and PFR seem to converge fairly quickly and you can get some general reads on your players even after just a few hands.


Even win-rate is a stat that can be worthwhile in a single-session if you feel that you can make adjustments vs. someone basedon how much they have won or lost recently. Sometimes it's difficult to notice somebody's balance or whether they have had a re-buy or two when you are playing 4 tables or more.


Again, it's not absolutely necessary to have these stats. I agree with some of the others on this.

Just disputing the idea that you can't gain anything meaningful on your opponents just off their single-session stats because I think that is extremely incorrect.

[/ QUOTE ]

Agree 100% and Yes you can use GT+ and PT for the downloaded hands.

See the link in this thread to PT forum on the patch and GT works as it normally does. (As has always been the case you can not see the player in seat 0)
Edited to Add Link: [ QUOTE ]
http://www.pokertracker.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=15445

[/ QUOTE ]

Whoever heard of a seat 0?? That's one thing I can't figure out that they did. Though I'd like it to change I won't talk about how much more business I'd give them if it did (hint: I'd spend somewhere around $50K MORE a month in sports bets if this was fixed) or claim they will go broke if it's not immediately fixed.

[Ali shmali]

this thread is hilarious. I like the sparky guy who said he beats the 5/10 limit games for over 6bb/100. Has it occured to anyone that the max tables at wpex is not even high. Isn't it at 4 tables right now? 4 tables!!!! I'll play 8 tables with out a hud. I wouldn't play 10, but 8 is fine. 6 is cake. At 4 a hud is basically irrellevant.

Good players beat the games with out a hud. Huds just make it easier for them. Losing players will lose their money without a hud. A hud just looks cool on their screen and makes em feel like an internet poker geek.

If wpex allowed you to sit at 8 or more tables I would understand this would make it more profitable for hud users. Not because it would give them an edge in the games but because it would allow them to play 10 tables and not 4,5, or 6.

Hud use is so trivial for a small site that caps the tables at 4. They need to focus on growing the player base. That should be the big issue. If allowing huds would up their player base they need to do it.

[PokerAce]

Bob, I could add support for WPEX. However, I really don't want to support a site that doesn't want my software and other similar software to work with their poker client.

I could add a feature that writes full hand histories complete with the players actual names that can be imported into PokerTracker, making PA Hud and PT fully functional for WPEX. Do I want to do that? Absolutely not.

As I've mentioned before, if they are intent on driving players away from their site and preventing new players from joining, that's their decision. I'm not going to go out of my way to make their site more attractive and useful if that's their attitude.

[Brice]

Can I have the PokerAce API so that I can write that program? [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Brice]

I honestly think the HUD vs no HUD crowd is like politics. No matter what you do or say, the other side is not going to change their mind. Period.

[MicroBob]

PA guy - Yes, I saw you mention this earlier in the thread and I respect your thoughts on not wanting to intrude your program where you feel it isn't welcome.

My thoughts on whether 1-session stats could actually be relevant were ONLY directed at that specific idea though which I happened to disagree with.

I've seen it mentioned by other posters in completely different discussions that you can't really get a read on your opponents unless you have at least 300 hands against them or something and I just think that is very wrong.

I wasn't trying to say that this is a reason WHY you should make PA work on WPEX though.


But since you are saying it would be reasonably not TOO impossible to do I will certainly look forward to the possibility that somebody else would come up with something as you suggest to work on WPEX.

But, until then, I'll be fine playing the games HUD-free there as well.


Ali - Yes, it's not too hard to concentrate on 3-4 tables for many players. Although I do like the HUD-stats even when playing so few tables.
But I'm sure that you, and many others, will play 8-10 tables in total with 3-4 of them being WPEX tables. At that point the HUD stats do tend to come in handy.

but I agree with your general point that not having them isn't exactly the end of the world.

[NoChance]

I want names in the HH. Until then, I have no problem playing elsewhere. Because of this, I have no reason to keep money in WPEX while I play elsewhere. If I had money there, I would compare lines and occasionally bet if the line is better than my other spots as I do bet NFL and NCAABB regularly. I think there are many others similar to my situation.

[MNpoker]

[ QUOTE ]
If I had money there,

[/ QUOTE ]

This is a pretty key point.

So because there are no names in the HH's you will not use WSEX even if they have the best lines, but go somewhere that offer NO poker.

And you will continue to pay rake rather than get HH's with no names.

Do you really think the GM at WSEX is buying into any of this?

I also love how ALL the people who need the names are coincidentally sportbettors who WOULD HAVE used WSEX but won't now.

[NoChance]

Sorry, I think you read into it too much. First, I like to multitable and the HUD makes that easier. Second, I like a better table selection and that wont happen until they increase traffic. Third, I wouldn't consider myself a huge sports better. I may bet about $500 per weekend in the NFL. Fourth, I did not do the mansion bet. Fifth, I had pulled my money out about a month ago for the reasons stated earlier. It had nothing to do with the current HH situation. I am simply saying that when names get added, it may correct the situation and make it more playable for me. Sixth, WSEX has a higher "juice" than my other sportsbooks so it does not bother me much if I am not making NFL bets there right now.

I think you are reading into my original post much more than is needed. No need to group me with all those other people. I am simply waiting for the names in the HH and that is all. We all have different preferences. I did play there off and on for three months.

[MNpoker]

I thought about my post and edited it, even before your response.

I agree 100% that you have every right to play when the site is suitable for you and not until then.

I did quit playing until they got the HH thing working myself.

P.S. Have you even given it a try since they put the HH's on the hard drive?