wasnt sure about this hand

Derek123 · #1 07-18-2006, 07:37 PM

I pretty much didnt like any of my options on the turn/river

Party Poker No-Limit Hold'em, $ Hero (10 handed) Hand History Converter Tool from FlopTurnRiver.com (Format: 2+2 Forums)

UTG+2 ($1934)
MP1 ($926)
MP2 ($2000)
MP3 ($1940)
CO ($3069.77)
Button ($2179)
SB ($2183.78)
Hero ($1852)
UTG ($1315.96)
UTG+1 ($3010.42)

Preflop: Hero is BB with K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img]. SB posts a blind of $10.
UTG calls $20, 3 folds, MP2 calls $20, 3 folds, SB (poster) completes, Hero checks.

Flop: ($80) 2[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], K[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img], 3[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (4 players)
SB checks, Hero checks, UTG checks, MP2 bets $50, SB calls $50, Hero raises to $250, UTG calls $250, MP2 folds, SB folds.

Turn: ($680) A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks.

River: ($680) 6[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] (2 players)
Hero checks, UTG bets $400, Hero folds.

Final Pot: $1080

Robb · #2 07-19-2006, 05:08 PM

I think this is a case where if you get action on the turn/river, it's the wrong kind of action (the kind where you're beat). So I almost always bet the flop looking to 3 bet big. If I cr the flop like you did, there is the potential I misplay the turn.

By lead betting the flop you are looking for opponents who will raise 1. to protect a lone King 2. a flush draw 3. a combo draw. Note that you are a small favorite over even a combo draw. I would lead bet big enough (pot) to define your opponents hand to the 3 hands above and unfortunately the 4th possibility: a set. By betting the pot it's much less likely they are calling with A3o/A5o/64 etc.

If I am raised I will probably push. I think it's greater EV to push because it is more likely that you are called by say....AK because it looks like YOU are the one with the big draw. But that is of course player dependent. Now I do this with combo draws myself so I have to balance the bet/3bet with made hands.

As played that Ac is the worse card in the deck for you. Additionally, you now have some sketchy outs - flush/full house. I think your redraws give you reverse implied odds: you're not going to make money if you hit and are best. If UTG is decent it sure looks like he has a set/AK/flush so I don't mind a check fold on the turn, even with your sketchy redraws. If UTG is bad you could bet/fold..tough to say without details on UTG.

At first glance I thought the river was check/fold but opponent shouldn't have a lone club in his hand. So either he had a flush on the turn or you beat him. However, I think if I was going to put any money in on the river it would have been to lead bet 400 and fold to a raise. But if you think opponent is capable at all of bluff raising then that play sucks. In the heat of the moment I probably check fold also.

Derek123 · #3 07-19-2006, 06:41 PM

Thanks for your comments. Your reasoning for lead/3betting the flop makes a lot of sense and makes the hand easier to play also.

I didnt have a strong read on UTG but from the 40 hands or so he seemed kind of weak, but fairly tight. I was confused by his bet on the river mostly because I didnt have a strogn read on him. I thought about leading but wasnt sure if a set would call so I checked and kind of thought it may have been an AK trying to get me off a set since I played it so weakly on turn/river but then just decided to fold. It just doesnt feel right since Im having truoble putting him on a hand.