How to observe opponents while multitabling?

[Damian UK]

have been grinding at 4 tabling the $20 and $30 for too long and its driving me mad.

So I started last week to single table the $109 and concentrate, and my results have improved rather than just become a push monkey (yes I know its a short time sample [img]/images/graemlins/tongue.gif[/img]).

I have no doubt that I will go back to multi tabling again, but playing for 'higher' stakes than I have been used to and only playing one table has helped me get my game and reads back together again - plus it isn't boring the bollocks off me at the mo either (unlike the 4 table grinds)

Just my thoughts

Damo

[DevinLake]

Hmmm, I don't take good notes or us PAHUD. I'm screwed.

However, I only play four at a time and for the most part I'm pretty happy with my read on players. I don't have a good knowledge of their postflop tendencies. However, I have a good idea about which ones will limp/call, limp/fold, mr/call, mr/fold late game, which I feel is the most important at the level I play.

I think Snarf alluded to this, the times I feel I have trouble getting reads is when I'm running continuous and have a couple games ITM at the same time. These tend to take all my concentration. So, when those games wrap up and I switch to the other tables I feel like I haven't seen a single hand played even though the blinds may already be 100/200.

[AMT]

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For those who are using PAHUD, what stats do you find the most useful during your game? I've used it for a bit, and aside from getting a hint about the general quality of player, I haven't found it that useful.

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VPIP and PFR are both VERY helpful for me, however, i rely both on PAhud AND taking good notes, and its helped me immensely. i only play 4-5 tables now but starting next week the SNGPT/multitabling experience is going to be upped significantly as i move up in levels and just in general. those two stats (VPIP and PFR) in my experience have been good indicators of putting villains on hand ranges and with my notes, acting accordingly. i may be using PAhud as more of a crutch when i up from 4/5 to 7/8 tables but generally i plan on using both notes and hud.

responding to people are say that PAhud isnt good because of small sample sizes: so are your reads on players (being of small sample), not to mention PT obviously stores numbers so you have the previous #s against regulars as well. that mixed in with the note taking, as pineapple pointed out i believe, is ideal IMO.

indy, i have a feeling PAhud would help you a lot. i feel like with time youd get to and be comfortable at 4 tables, and be happy there. just my feeling based on how you speak of multi tabling and your apparent comfort zone. gl.

[pineapple888]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
For those who are using PAHUD, what stats do you find the most useful during your game? I've used it for a bit, and aside from getting a hint about the general quality of player, I haven't found it that useful.

[/ QUOTE ]

responding to people are say that PAhud isnt good because of small sample sizes: so are your reads on players (being of small sample),

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Good point, but part of the skill here is understanding the implications of your notes so you can extrapolate behavior in other situations, also you can indicate the reliability of your notes (I add a "?" if it's not a solid read yet).

[EscapePlan9]

[ QUOTE ]
For those who are using PAHUD, what stats do you find the most useful during your game? I've used it for a bit, and aside from getting a hint about the general quality of player, I haven't found it that useful.

[/ QUOTE ]

Honestly, VPIP and PFR are most important. Then went to showdown and aggression per streets. If I'm about to take a stab at some decent sized pot against one player, I make a habit out of quickly checking their WtSD rate. Less than 20% and I bet more often than not. I don't do it against the donks who will call you with overcard draws and whatever.

[NoahSD]

I'm new to 8-tabling, so my advice probably isn't worth much.

I use PAHUD, which is huge... against many players, 40/0/.5 is all you need to know [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]. Other than that, I'm really only able to pay attention to pots that I'm involved in on all but one table. I usually try and watch all hands at one specific table (the most short-handed, typically). I have a bunch of specific things that I note, like if a player limps AA, or if they limp/fold to a push, and I find them to be very helpful.

[ThorKGB]

Tip for a quick and efficient read:

Sharkscope.

Two clicks on the site just seconds after you have started a new table provides you with all the nice stats. When you see the roi, total profit/loss for the entire table while still in the second or third hand, you can easily predict what will happen.

[uphigh_downlow]

Play style changes frpm level to level for any decent player. So no point trying to understand what they were doing, unless you are taking lvl specific notes.

As for the below average players, you wont need many reads on them anyway.

Thats why multitabling isnt too -EV/table. Now if we had many more hands/ level, it cud be a different story

[jwesty5]

I 10 table and can honestly say I don't go by many reads other than the ones I get from PAHUD. And if you use PAHUD you should definitely filter it by the number of players remaining.

The best read for me is 9-handed when it starts. Anyone with a VPIP 9 handed of >20%+ is pretty much going to be a donator. Anyone less than 15% is probably 2+2 or at least slightly has a clue.

I tried taking notes for a little while but PS kept stealing my focus while I was taking notes and it always ended up as chat at a different table so I gave up.

[jgunnip]

I 8 table the 33 regs with PAHUD but also would like to become better at note taking, mostly for when my bankroll allows me to move up. The stats I use in pahud are vpip and pfr, with these two pieces of information you can separate the solid players from the donks. the other stats c-bet %, check-raise % are stats that need many many hands played to become significant imo. There are only a few players who i've played over 1000 sng hands with, so i rarely looking at any other stats.

While playing i look for multitablers, if they are playing more than three tables i'll make a note of this and use the search function to see how many there are playing. many players play two at a time, but only basically if you run into a 6+ tabler you've probably got a solid player. I'll watch these players more closely than the donks.

Noting which players are donks and which are solid allows me to better estimate their ranges in the late game. I usually don't have more than 4-5 tables in push/fold mode so i can pay attention to most hands pretty well and if a player makes a call or a push that i'd deem as outside of their donk/solid mold then i'll make a note of it.

I rarely make notes on players who aren't playing 4+ tables since i just don't play with them enough for the note to really be of any help. the only notes i'll keep on donks is if they are limping big pocket pairs and trying to trap with them. For the multitablers if they make a push and get called and then show 95o or something, i'll make a note that they are capable of pushing any two. if a player misses and obvious any two push from the SB i'll make a note of this. If they are making standard raises after level 3 i'll pay close attention to these hands in hope of a showdown so i can better narrow down their ranges. With some regualrs a raise of 3xBB on level 4 and beyond will mean QQ+ 90% of the time. Other than these types of notes I don't do much.

most of my notes just say "6 tables 33r" or something like that so i know what limits they play and how many tables. at the moment my note taking is mostly oriented around better beign able to estimate push/calling ranges for the late game. I'm hoping in the future i'll be able to take better notes for the early and mid game as i move up in limits where basic push/fold isn't as profitable.