I just told a guy....

[The Worm]

Thank you, if it wasnt for him and players like him Id have to work harder in real life. I am super drunk at this moment, and dont normally pkay when Im like this, but I needed some action. This player beat me multiple times on 7th with 2 under pairs, after calling either 6th or 6th and 7th with a small pair, no draw vs my over pair showing. Had to say something, but I didnt want to berate him. Over the past 6 months I have learned to control my anger and nurture these players, hoping that they stay longer and play the same way, I am just wondering if I crossed th line by what I said as far as trying to get them to stay.


PS he hasnt left yet and has given me all my money back plus some.

[lewfather]

I love the spelling in this post but seriously, I have the same problem from time to time. I've been working on it for awhile. Maybe it's just my style to be a dbag? LoL

[The Worm]

Cause I spelled play, pkay or the, th? I pointed out early in the thread I am loaded, thought that would excuse me from poor spelling. If not I apologize for my poor spelling, many here can attest too, English is not something they teach you a lot of in Business School.

[BlueSmurf]

[ QUOTE ]
Thank you, if it wasnt for him and players like him Id have to work harder in real life.

[/ QUOTE ]

That's not berating people? What is it then?

Everybody understands the frustration of being beaten to a bloody pulp by clueless donkeys, but will you please stop talking to them if you aren't specifically praising them for their excellent and brave play!

Here are some acceptable comments:

"I've seen you take down some nice pots with two small pairs. I wish I had the guts to hang in there on 6th with only a small pair, but that's probably why you're a winning player and I'm a losing player."

"Wow! You just knew that I was trying to move you off your deuces with my aces, and you knew you had the odds to call me down. That's some awsome poker right there."

"I usually don't call all the way with nothing, but you do it in the right spots with surgical precision. Great hand!"

God bless'em. May they never run out of funds.

Cheers,

Smurf

[Wahoo73]

Ahhh, yes....I love the smell of sarcasm in the morning! It is also my weapon of choice when playing against and chatting with morons/idiots/maniacs/donkeys at stud tables.

My sarcasm towards them tends a little more toward self-deprecating humor though. I say things like, "How foolish of me to think that my As over wouldn't hold up to your small, unconnected three-card flush on 5th street. I'm just too stupid to recognize the excellent odds you had to catch runner diamonds to fill it out." Or, "I'm obviously over-matched by your talent to catch the only card in the deck on the river that would beat my hand. Will you give me lessons on how to do that?"

[MRBAA]

Why say anything? The odds are the odds, EV is EV. People can play any way they want -- it's their money. Unless they are drawing dead, they are going to win sometimes. Furthermore, on later streets calling station play can be correct in stud, even if the earlier street play that built the pot was not.

[lstream]

I agree entirely on not saying anything. What can it possibly achieve other than actually convincing them to change their play, or to get up and leave?

There is a type of player who is not so bad and thinks they are above the crowd and runs around berating the fish. I will often agitate them to deflect their barrages against the fish. Sometimes they go on tilt against me, which is even better [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

If I chat with a fish, I end up just in friendly banter to try and get them to hang around. Making them enjoy being at the table should be the goal I think.

[Wahoo73]

Of course, you and MRBAA are correct...and saying nothing to them is what I do 99% of the time. But during that other 1% (which occurs most often for me late at night when I'm tired and irritable and shouldn't be playing anyway [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]), I can't help myself to go with some sarcastic, self-deprecation, which they are probably too daft to understand anyway. [img]/images/graemlins/grin.gif[/img]

[MRBAA]

While there are definitely some idiots playing online, many players who lose are not idiots at all. I was just in Las Vegas and was playing in a great 8-16 game with some wild players. One man who owned a jewelry business felt that 3 and 8 were his lucky numbers and played that hand aggressively. He wasn't a fool, he was playing hold'em to gamble and have fun. And he was pleasant to play with. He personally put a whupping on my QQ with his 29 sooted. Played it well, too. Got in his c/r on the turn. For awhile he had a mountain of chips, then he rebought a few times, then built a mountain again, and when I left he was getting low again. I wouldn't presume to tell him how to play -- he may be much more successful than I in his business, and he likes playing the way he is. In this same game was a land developer who had flown in from Montana with his partner on their private jet. He was playing very loose because he sure didn't come to Las Vegas for a day to fold -- he came to play.

It cracks me up to hear strong players at low and mid limits dump on players who don't play "right". It often indicates a combination of lack of understanding of the odds, lack of understanding of variance and lack of understanding of their opponents. Hey, Bill Gates likes to play 3-6 at the Mirage when he comes to town -- think he's a fish?

[Fierce Lion7]

Very well said.

I have to admit that it really angers me when I hear these table coaches going nuts berating players.

To me, it is the height of absurdity. Do some of these "great" players REALLY want everyone to be a strong player?

In "The Psychology of Poker" by Alan Scoonmaker he makes a great point about this using Hold 'Em as an example. HE uses pre-flop Aces to illustrate his point.

He talks about how in a bad game, you will see a lot of players go all the way to the river and in tough games, a lot of the players fold.

To the point, your Aces will hold up more in the tough game but you will make less money overall. In the looser games they get cracked way more often but you make more money in the long run.

The problem is some players (It seems even here on 2+2.) would rather play in a less chaotic environment than the Donks provide. What they dont realize is you play for the long run and not for pots.

When I say Donks, I say it without rancor. They are playing a game that they enjoy (For the most part.). I don't want everyone to be a superstar. I want them all to chase. Sometimes I slip when I get destroyed by Donks and they get arrogant about it. I'm working on it.

Last night I played in a shorthanded nickel and dime Stud game and I got destroyed. Since I have been beating these people 80% of the time for years and I never lose much when they win, I wasn't mad.

Three hands killed me in particular. My enemy got a Straight Flush, Four sixes, and three aces to my rolled up Kings. He chased for all of them while enduring aggressive raising from me.

Was it stupid? Yes. I high-fived him every time though.

When I look at my Poker Tracker and see 28% of the folks are winners and the rest are losers, I don't get angry at the losers. That would be moronic.

So these stories about Donks that should play better reflect poorly on the posters.

Now I will get drunk and lose some money, LOL!

Arioch7