How often are you in the money?

[nath]

I expect to [censored] up repeatedly.
My tournament game needs retooling.

[0evg0]

[ QUOTE ]
I think the mindset is what is important. You must have the mindset to finish in the top 10, or better. There are certain hands that come up that you would play differently if you are playing for the top 10 vs. playing to go as far as you can.

For instance, with 60 players left and you have 1/2 the average stack from the BB, and you have KJ. Some else raises big. Depending on the situation, you may be inclined to call a hand here that you normally wouldn't, or even go all in.

You can gamble here, and get to the average chip stack, or fold, and slowly get blinded out and finish in the 40th place.

It is hard to come up with the right example, because I would fold that hand quite often. Still, I am very aware of what the average chip stack is, and if I fall to far below the average, I gamble a lot more.

(I have finished in the top 10 ~25 times this year with 4 firsts and 5 2nds out of hundreds of tourneys)

[/ QUOTE ]

Average chip stack doesn't mean a damn thing. If that's what your basing your plays on, then you're making a huge mistake.

You lose a big pot in the first 10 mins of the Stars Million, you're down to t1100, average is over 2x that at around t2600. Are you now inclined to make plays you wouldn't have if you were at the average?

[Uncle_Billy]

*snip*
Average chip stack doesn't mean a damn thing. If that's what your basing your plays on, then you're making a huge mistake.

You lose a big pot in the first 10 mins of the Stars Million, you're down to t1100, average is over 2x that at around t2600. Are you now inclined to make plays you wouldn't have if you were at the average?

*snip

Clarify please for the dummies like me - I'm always aware of where I stand versus the average - when I'm significantly lower than average, I know I have to start gambling a little more than normal...

I also weigh this against my stack size vs. blinds (~M) - so if I'm only average or below but have 40 blinds (for example), I'm less inclined to start trying to catch up. I probably base my actions more on this, as well as my relative stack to those on the table, but keeping track of the average often helps me from falling too far behind.

[roamer590]

If you have t1100 and the blinds are 10/20, you have alot of room to maneuvre and play, even though your stack is half of the average in the tourney. You have time to wait for some good cards to get your stack growing.

If you are in the late stages of a tourney however, your stack size vs. average stack will be more important, as you will often need to stay well ahead of the average to maintain a comfortable stack.

Your stack size vs. the blinds and antes are way more important factors that should affect your play. Like Harrington says about the averagestack-yourstack ratio being the "weak force" compared to the "strong force", the M. (Your stack vs. blinds and antes)

[0evg0]

For a real-life example, I lost over half my stack in the first 5 minutes of a $33 Deep-Stack the other day.

So while avg stack was around 5500, I was down to 2100.

I immediately was pissed, and OMG OMG I'm done already.

Then I remembered I still had OVER 100XBB, played poker and did fine.

Your stack in relation to the blinds is roughly 5435228x more important than compared to the avg.

[brian8065]

I don't consider Average Chip Size until later in the tournament. I try not to get distressed if I lose a hand early and am below 1000 chips when we started with less than 3000.

I do consider it very closely late in the tournament, which is what my example was about. I am more making the point that there is no real difference between 60 and 40 in a large MTT. The real money is in the top 10.

At some point you have to go with the cards you have, and try to double up to get to the average chip size in my example.

I didn't state it, but it is also a function of the number of bets you have vs. the cost per round. This is another number I constantly consider.

If I have at or around the average stack, I remain patient, and wait for my opportunities. When I am even somewhat shortstacked, I become impatient, and gamble a lot more.

IF I remain patient I will get blinded out within the next 20 places. This means I cannot remain patient.

Early on when I am shortstacked, but in no danger of getting blinded out, I still remain patient.

[PokerLearner]

I don't understand this talk about average stack size, even late in a tournament. Why does this matter? I consider my stack size relative to the blinds (i.e. how many orbits I have), I consider how long until the blinds will go up, and I compare my stack size to others on my table (not to all players in the tournament). I like to know who on my table can kill me, and whom I can kill. Ones you can kill are more likely to be afraid of you and thus easier to steal their blinds.
What do you gain from knowing the average stack? Bear in mind that this number is often inflated by some enomorous big stack somewhere, and so isn't the same as the average player's stack.

[Shibby]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't understand this talk about average stack size, even late in a tournament. Why does this matter? I consider my stack size relative to the blinds (i.e. how many orbits I have), I consider how long until the blinds will go up, and I compare my stack size to others on my table (not to all players in the tournament). I like to know who on my table can kill me, and whom I can kill. Ones you can kill are more likely to be afraid of you and thus easier to steal their blinds.
What do you gain from knowing the average stack? Bear in mind that this number is often inflated by some enomorous big stack somewhere, and so isn't the same as the average player's stack.

[/ QUOTE ]
FWIW, this number is never inflated. It's an average that's based on Total chips in play divided by entrants left.

[roamer590]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't understand this talk about average stack size, even late in a tournament. Why does this matter? I consider my stack size relative to the blinds (i.e. how many orbits I have), I consider how long until the blinds will go up, and I compare my stack size to others on my table (not to all players in the tournament). I like to know who on my table can kill me, and whom I can kill. Ones you can kill are more likely to be afraid of you and thus easier to steal their blinds.
What do you gain from knowing the average stack? Bear in mind that this number is often inflated by some enomorous big stack somewhere, and so isn't the same as the average player's stack.

[/ QUOTE ]

What if you are suddenly placed on a table with only bigger stacks than yourself? You have to consider the whole tournament as one game, not only think about your own table.
The average stack size for me is a reminder to never stop collecting as many chips as possible, to stay on top of the field.

[Jack-in-a-box]

I would say avg is important when you are playing turbos. Blinds increase fast and nobody actually has a huge stack. So in those games, I think, Q is strong force