Party rebuy tourney refund request (long)

[Fishy McDonk]

Party gave me $30, so I entered a rebuy tourney. Follows is my correspondence with Party CS.

Forgive any repetition, but I know it is supposed to be helpful in teaching children, so I thought it might be helpful in dealing with Party employees. I was wrong.
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I request that you refund my account for my entry fee and rebuys totalling $26. When I signed up for this tournament, I understood I was signing up to play in a tournament where no player or players had an unfair advantage. The rules of the tournament stated that a player could not rebuy unless he was under the starting amount of chips. At the tables I was on, players were making rebuys even though they had well in excess of the starting amount of chips. There are 2 instances of this in the short sequence of the 3 hands below. This happened many more times during the rebuy period and it gave these players an unfair advantage over me. I followed the rules and only made a rebuy when I was below the starting amount of chips.


#Game No : 4383768423
***** Hand History for Game 4383768423 *****
NL Texas Hold'em Trny:24193206 Level:2 Blinds(30/60) - Sunday, May 28,
16:58:03 ET 2006
Table Rebuy(711030) Table #69 (Real Money)
Seat 4 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: HERO ( $4530 )
Seat 2: BS4SURE ( $17230 )
Seat 3: MAIL_GUY ( $7260 )
Seat 4: KAIDUDE ( $5505 )
Seat 5: Cincinnati_O ( $2890 )
Seat 6: scottcan ( $2570 )
Seat 7: cerilloin ( $5880 )
Seat 8: davem226 ( $5775 )
Seat 9: bladekev ( $12240 )
Seat 10: P__E__T__E ( $8240 )
Trny:24193206 Level:2
Blinds(30/60)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to HERO [ 5d Ah ]
cerilloin folds.
davem226 raises [120].
bladekev folds.
P__E__T__E calls [120].
HERO folds.
BS4SURE calls [120].
MAIL_GUY calls [120].
KAIDUDE calls [120].
Cincinnati_O: watch the avg go up past you and then tell me how smart you slow idiots are
Cincinnati_O folds.
scottcan folds.
** Dealing Flop ** [ Kd, 7s, Ks ]
bladekev: nobody is playin slow now u retard
davem226 checks.
P__E__T__E checks.
BS4SURE checks.
MAIL_GUY checks.
KAIDUDE checks.
** Dealing Turn ** [ Td ]
Cincinnati_O: while other tables are playing 3 times the hands as this table
davem226 bets [200].
bladekev: so shut the [censored] up
P__E__T__E calls [200].
Cincinnati_O: cerillion is
BS4SURE: a lot smarter than u cinnci, the way u play u will never be near the average...
BS4SURE raises [1525].
MAIL_GUY folds.
KAIDUDE folds.
davem226 calls [1325].
P__E__T__E calls [1325].
** Dealing River ** [ 9d ]
davem226 checks.
P__E__T__E is all-In [6595]
Cincinnati_O: i have won more of these tourneys than you have play retard
BS4SURE is all-In [15585]
davem226 folds.
P__E__T__E shows [ Ad, 8d ] a flush, ace high.
BS4SURE shows [ Kh, 8c ] three of a kind, kings.
BS4SURE wins 8990 chips from side pot #1 with three of a kind, kings.
P__E__T__E wins 18455 chips from the main pot with a flush, ace high.
Re-buy: P__E__T__E re-buys 3000 chips and the chip stack increases from 18455 chips to 21455 chips.
Game #4383779303 starts.

#Game No : 4383779303
***** Hand History for Game 4383779303 *****
NL Texas Hold'em Trny:24193206 Level:2 Blinds(30/60) - Sunday, May 28,
16:59:47 ET 2006
Table Rebuy(711030) Table #69 (Real Money)
Seat 5 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: HERO ( $4530 )
Seat 2: BS4SURE ( $8990 )
Seat 3: MAIL_GUY ( $7140 )
Seat 4: KAIDUDE ( $5385 )
Seat 5: Cincinnati_O ( $2860 )
Seat 6: scottcan ( $2510 )
Seat 7: cerilloin ( $5880 )
Seat 8: davem226 ( $4130 )
Seat 9: bladekev ( $12240 )
Seat 10: P__E__T__E ( $21455 )
Trny:24193206 Level:2
Blinds(30/60)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to HERO [ 4d Th ]
davem226 calls [60].
bladekev calls [60].
BS4SURE: nh
P__E__T__E folds.
HERO folds.
P__E__T__E: ty
BS4SURE folds.
MAIL_GUY folds.
KAIDUDE raises [2400].
P__E__T__E: damn, the average is really passing me, hurry up guys! WAHHHH!
Cincinnati_O: it's going up about 200 for every 1 hand we play
bladekev: ive played thousands,well done u must b rich
Cincinnati_O folds.
scottcan folds.
cerilloin folds.
davem226 folds.
bladekev folds.
KAIDUDE does not show cards.
KAIDUDE wins 2610 chips
Re-buy: KAIDUDE re-buys 3000 chips and the chip stack increases from 5595 chips to 8595 chips.
Game #4383785710 starts.

#Game No : 4383785710
***** Hand History for Game 4383785710 *****
NL Texas Hold'em Trny:24193206 Level:2 Blinds(30/60) - Sunday, May 28,
17:00:49 ET 2006
Table Rebuy(711030) Table #69 (Real Money)
Seat 6 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: HERO ( $4530 )
Seat 2: BS4SURE ( $8990 )
Seat 3: MAIL_GUY ( $7140 )
Seat 4: KAIDUDE ( $8595 )
Seat 5: Cincinnati_O ( $2860 )
Seat 6: scottcan ( $2480 )
Seat 7: cerilloin ( $5820 )
Seat 8: davem226 ( $4070 )
Seat 9: bladekev ( $12180 )
Seat 10: P__E__T__E ( $21455 )
Trny:24193206 Level:2
Blinds(30/60)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to HERO [ 5c Qd ]
bladekev: thats why u cant afford a rebuy
bladekev folds.
P__E__T__E folds.
HERO folds.
BS4SURE calls [60].
Cincinnati_O: i never rebuy
MAIL_GUY calls [60].
KAIDUDE calls [60].
BS4SURE: dont c our name in the tourney leader board...
Cincinnati_O folds.
scottcan calls [60].
cerilloin calls [30].
davem226 checks.
** Dealing Flop ** [ 5d, Qc, 6h ]
HERO: How did PETE rebuy with so many chips?
bladekev: cos uve got no money cos ur wan k
cerilloin checks.
davem226 bets [100].
BS4SURE folds.
MAIL_GUY folds.
KAIDUDE calls [100].
scottcan folds.
bladekev: go allin & rebuy then
cerilloin folds.
** Dealing Turn ** [ Jc ]
davem226 bets [150].
Cincinnati_O: now that's smart
KAIDUDE calls [150].
** Dealing River ** [ Ac ]
bladekev: its a risk tho
davem226 bets [1225].
KAIDUDE folds.
davem226 does not show cards.
Cincinnati_O: duh i want to go all in and lose so i can rebuy
davem226 wins 2085 chips
Re-buy: davem226 re-buys 3000 chips and the chip stack increases from 4620 chips to 7620 chips.
Game #4383798330 starts.


Dear HERO,

Thank you for contacting us.

I understand that players can re-buy only when they have chips less than or equal to chips they started the tournament with.

Please know that all the players have an option to do a re-buy when the hand is in progress. This happens when the player goes all-in (has chips less than what the tournament started with) and then request for a re-buy immediately, the re-buy chips are credited in the next hand irrespective of whether the player wins or loses the hand.

For more details on "Re-Buy's and Add-ons", please visit the following link:

http://www.partypoker.com/tournaments/rebuys.html

I am sorry to inform that we will be unable to make any refund for this tournament.

Praful
PartyPoker Customer Care




Yes, I read the page you linked me to before I entered the tournament and nowhere does it say that one may rebuy while the hand is in progress. That makes no sense and is not allowed in any online or live tournament anywhere.
Here is what is says:

"A rebuy is only available before the first break and will only be available to players who are at or below their original chip count."

Since you are aware that players are allowed to rebuy while a hand is in progress, regardless of the amount of chips they have or would be left with even if they lost the hand, you have deliberately misled players to believe otherwise by omitting this from your rebuy tournament description webpage. Therefore, I insist that you refund the money I paid for this tournament which I entered under your false pretenses which gave other players an unfair advantage.


Dear HERO,

We apologize for any discomfort faced in this regard.
The tournaments with the rebuy option allow a player to buy more chips when he/she goes allin and then request for more chips. If the player loses the hand then he is given the additional chips requested. However, if the hand is won then the winning chips and the requested additional chips will be given to the player.

Further to your concern, please note that the option to rebuy is available to all the players and has the same restrictions. A refund in this situation cannot be made to your account.

Once again we apologize for the inconvenience and appreciate your cooperation.

Have a nice day!!

Prasen
PartyPoker Customer Care



So then by your own admission, this statement from your website is false:

"A rebuy is only available before the first break and will only be available to players who are at or below their original chip count."

In the 1st hand, BS4SURE lost the hand and still had ovet the original chip count but was allowed to rebuy. In the 2nd hand, BS4SURE won the hand and had far in excess of the original chip count and was allowed to rebuy. In this hand, EVEN IF HE HAD LOST, he would have had more than the original chip count!

TELL ME EXACTLY HOW THIS:

"A rebuy is only available before the first break and will only be available to players who are at or below their original chip count."


COULD BE INTERPRETED AS ANYTHING OTHER THAN A FALSE STATEMENT?


You can either refund my money and I will stay clear of your Re-buy tourneys, or this can drag on and on until it spreads all over the poker universe.



#Game No : 4383840979
***** Hand History for Game 4383840979 *****
NL Texas Hold'em Trny:24193206 Level:2 Blinds(30/60) - Sunday, May 28,
17:09:22 ET 2006
Table Rebuy(711030) Table #69 (Real Money)
Seat 2 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: HERO ( $4410 )
Seat 2: BS4SURE ( $12110 )
Seat 3: MAIL_GUY ( $7335 )
Seat 4: KAIDUDE ( $14840 )
Seat 5: Cincinnati_O ( $2950 )
Seat 6: scottcan ( $2360 )
Seat 7: cerilloin ( $5760 )
Seat 8: davem226 ( $7500 )
Seat 9: bladekev ( $11790 )
Seat 10: P__E__T__E ( $21065 )
Trny:24193206 Level:2
Blinds(30/60)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to HERO [ 9s 9h ]
BS4SURE: wow u won a bunch
Cincinnati_O: no one had balls
Cincinnati_O folds.
scottcan calls [60].
BS4SURE: no.. no one had a hand...
cerilloin calls [60].
davem226 folds.
bladekev folds.
P__E__T__E folds.
HERO raises [220].
BS4SURE is all-In [12110]
MAIL_GUY folds.
KAIDUDE folds.
scottcan folds.
cerilloin is all-In [5700]
HERO is all-In [4190]
** Dealing Flop ** [ 7d, 3h, Ks ]
** Dealing Turn ** [ Ts ]
** Dealing River ** [ Jh ]
HERO shows [ 9s, 9h ] a pair of nines.
BS4SURE shows [ 9c, 9d ] a pair of nines.
cerilloin shows [ Ah, As ] a pair of aces.
BS4SURE wins 6350 chips from side pot #2 with a pair of nines.
cerilloin wins 2700 chips from side pot #1 with a pair of aces.
cerilloin wins 13380 chips from the main pot with a pair of aces.
Re-buy: BS4SURE re-buys 3000 chips and the chip stack increases from 6350 chips to 9350 chips.
Re-buy: HERO re-buys 3000 chips and the chip stack increases from 0 chips to 3000 chips.


#Game No : 4383710235
***** Hand History for Game 4383710235 *****
NL Texas Hold'em Trny:24193206 Level:1 Blinds(20/40) - Sunday, May 28,
16:48:58 ET 2006
Table Rebuy(711030) Table #69 (Real Money)
Seat 9 is the button
Total number of players : 10
Seat 1: HERO ( $2920 )
Seat 2: BS4SURE ( $11390 )
Seat 3: MAIL_GUY ( $6800 )
Seat 4: KAIDUDE ( $5940 )
Seat 5: Cincinnati_O ( $2950 )
Seat 6: scottcan ( $2900 )
Seat 7: cerilloin ( $2920 )
Seat 8: davem226 ( $2940 )
Seat 9: bladekev ( $12240 )
Seat 10: P__E__T__E ( $9120 )
Trny:24193206 Level:1
Blinds(20/40)
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to HERO [ 8c Ah ]
BS4SURE calls [40].
MAIL_GUY folds.
KAIDUDE folds.
Cincinnati_O folds.
scottcan folds.
cerilloin folds.
davem226 folds.
MAIL_GUY: in stead of call name lets work together
bladekev folds.
P__E__T__E calls [20].
Cincinnati_O: do you have a problem chosing paper or plastic too?
MAIL_GUY: calling
HERO checks.
** Dealing Flop ** [ As, 8d, Th ]
P__E__T__E checks.
HERO checks.
BS4SURE is all-In [11350]
P__E__T__E folds.
Cincinnati_O: my 96 yr old grandma thinks faster
HERO is all-In [2880]
** Dealing Turn ** [ Ks ]
** Dealing River ** [ Qc ]
HERO shows [ 8c, Ah ] two pairs, aces and eights.
BS4SURE shows [ Td, Jh ] a straight, ten to ace.
BS4SURE wins 8470 chips from side pot #1 with a straight, ten to ace.
BS4SURE wins 5880 chips from the main pot with a straight, ten to ace.
Re-buy: BS4SURE re-buys 3000 chips and the chip stack increases from 14350 chips to 17350 chips.
Re-buy: HERO re-buys 3000 chips and the chip stack increases from 0 chips to 3000 chips.




Dear HERO,

Players will be able to re-buy into the tournaments only when their chip count is below their original chip count. However, if a player goes all-in, then his chip count will be less than his original chip count and can re-buy into the tournament. All players gave this option and even you will be able to re-buy into the tournament by going all-in. However, we will forward your comments to the management who will look into the matter.


We thank you for your support and co-operation in this regard.


Kasams
PartyPoker Customer Care



Please inform me of "management's" resolution of this issue. Anyone with a 4th grade education could see the flawed logic in your "allin" argument. To test this theory, I sought out a 4th grader who lives in my complex. I breifly explained to him what poker is, what a poker tournament is and what a rebuy is. I then read him the rebuy rules.

"A rebuy is only available before the first break and will only be availableto players who are at or below their original chip count."

I them gave him this simple problem to solve:


All players start with 3000 in chips and it is before the 1st break.

Dick has 7000 in chips. Jane has 3000 in chips. Dick puts all his chips in the pot and Sue calls. There are no other players involved in the hand.


Me: How many chips will Dick have if he loses the hand?

4th grader: Uh.....4000.

Me: Can Dick rebuy if he loses the hand?

4th grader: Uh.....no, 4000 is more than 3000.

Me: How many chips will Dick have if he wins the hand?

4th grader: Uh.....(takes a little more time).....10000.

Me: Can Dick rebuy if he wins the hand?

4th grader:: Uh....seems like kindofa stupid question, but no.

Me: Would you believe you are smarter than Party executives?

4th grader: (giving me a quizical look)...What are Party executives?

Me: never mind.




Dear HERO,

The issue is already forwarded to the management team, however these tournaments (RE-BUY AND ADD-ONS) are designed in such a way that the re-buy option will only be available to players who are below or at their original chip count.

If a player has made a bet in a hand and if his chip count is below the original chip count then irrespective of the out come of that hand the player will be given the re-buy option.

Please check the below given link for more information on the RE-BUY and ADD-ONS

http://www.partypoker.com/tournaments/rebuys.html

Rekha
PartyPoker Customer Care

[skiier04]

This has been a known glitch for a long time and Party doesnt care.


I highly doubt you get your money back.

[AngusThermopyle]

[ QUOTE ]
When I signed up for this tournament, I understood I was signing up to play in a tournament where no player or players had an unfair advantage.

[/ QUOTE ]

Exactly who had an unfair advantage?
Well known "feature" that anybody can exploit.

[Fishy McDonk]

[ QUOTE ]

Exactly who had an unfair advantage?
Well known "feature" that anybody can exploit.

[/ QUOTE ]

Well known to those who have played in them before, maybe. Not even dreamed of by anyone who has played in a "normal" rebuy tourney.

Woe be to the unfortunate hombre who reads the rules page and having enough to enter and make several rebuys thinks he has a chance at making the money!

[Fishy McDonk]

And BTW, they have not admitted it's a glitch. THEY THINK THAT THIS IS THE WAY IT IS SUPPOSED TO BE!

[Copernicus]

If you really did the 4th grader thing, you have way too much time on your hands.

[Clayton]

[ QUOTE ]
And BTW, they have not admitted it's a glitch. THEY THINK THAT THIS IS THE WAY IT IS SUPPOSED TO BE!

[/ QUOTE ]

Pick something less retarded to whine about.

You want your money back? LOLOLOLOL. Loser.

[Fishy McDonk]

[ QUOTE ]

Pick something less retarded to whine about.


[/ QUOTE ]


I couldn't find anything more retarded than the Party rebuy tourney if I tried. So yes, the next thing I whine about will be less retarded.

[Andykay]

Eh, I like that system. It's fun to have a 20k stack in the first ten minutes, just by rebuying over and over.

-Andrew

[elliot]

[ QUOTE ]
Pick something less retarded to whine about.

You want your money back? LOLOLOLOL. Loser.

[/ QUOTE ]