a river fold I don't usually make but probably should more often?

[ILOVEPOKER929]

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I think the flop checkraise is good because this opponent calls down very light. He will basically take any decent A high or pair to showndown.

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With this read, now I like your flop checkraise.

[bozlax]

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I think the flop checkraise is good because this opponent calls down very light. He will basically take any decent A high or pair to showndown.

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Ohhhhh-kaaaaaay, but then isn't either your turn call or your river fold bad? I mean, every time you checked to him, he did exactly what you expected him to do, and yet somehow that gives you enough information to make it to the river and then fold?

Edit: actually, shouldn't you have just kept betting after the flop?

[Nate tha\\\' Great]

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I think the flop checkraise is good because this opponent calls down very light. He will basically take any decent A high or pair to showndown.

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Ohhhhh-kaaaaaay, but then isn't either your turn call or your river fold bad? I mean, every time you checked to him, he did exactly what you expected him to do, and yet somehow that gives you enough information to make it to the river and then fold?

Edit: actually, shouldn't you have just kept betting after the flop?

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Hero often has 8 outs on the turn with his OESD. If there's just a small chance that his opponent both (a) has a worse hand or tied hand, and (b) gives up with it on the river, then that probably pushes the call into +EV territory.

[bozlax]

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I think the flop checkraise is good because this opponent calls down very light. He will basically take any decent A high or pair to showndown.

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Ohhhhh-kaaaaaay, but then isn't either your turn call or your river fold bad? I mean, every time you checked to him, he did exactly what you expected him to do, and yet somehow that gives you enough information to make it to the river and then fold?

Edit: actually, shouldn't you have just kept betting after the flop?

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Hero often has 8 outs on the turn with his OESD. If there's just a small chance that his opponent both (a) has a worse hand or tied hand, and (b) gives up with it on the river, then that probably pushes the call into +EV territory.

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Right, which is what I'm getting at with my edit. Hero should have just bet the turn and river as well, or at least the river. He never gave Vill a chance to give up his hand, he just kept letting him do what he thought he'd do, and then gave up to it himself. Unless the preflop 3-bet pushes Vill into a range where Hero shouldn't even be playing after the jack on the turn. Right?

[siegfriedandroy]

are we even justified in calling the turn bet, then (assuming his read is quite precise)? seems at best you're drawing to 5 outs

[geormiet]

my note which reads "bets when checked to" probably came from a hand where I saw him make a weak river bluff attempt in an obvious bluff inducing situation, or a turn bet when a free card would have been a better decision. Sorry I didn't clarify, it definitely doesn't mean he blindly bets whenever he has a chance. I think he would check behind a JJ type hand.

This hand, where he bet the turn and river in a situation where it really should look like I will call (imo to him it should look like I have a pair but I am afraid of AK), is a different story.

Whether folding the turn is a good idea is a consideration I hadn't thought of, but I think it has some merit. My plan was to call the turn hoping that either a) I improve, or b) he checks behind a worse hand on the river.

[bozlax]

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My plan was to call the turn hoping that either a) I improve, or b) he checks behind a worse hand on the river.

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Your line makes better sense in light of your modified read, but in that case I think you should definitely have folded the turn. The pot's just too small to call down for what, off the cuff, works out to about 3-4 outs.

[steveyz]

Except for the fact that villian has a PFR of 8 and 3-bet hero's EP raise, which should mean he has hero crushed the majority of the time even on the flop. His range should be AA-JJ, AK, maybe TT and AQs. On the turn hero is surely drawing, possibly dead to a chop. Even if villian is the type that would call down with AK or JJ unimproved, I don't think the flop c/r is wise given his limited range.

How you play a blank turn should be based on if you think he'd check through with AK or JJ. But donk-folding a blank turn and if called, betting a blank river seems like the best plan.

[flawless_victory]

wow that is a pretty easy river fold.
i usually checkcall the flop, but since u CRed i like the turn c/c. river, i dont see what u could beat?

[luckychewy]

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wow that is a pretty easy river fold.
i usually checkcall the flop, but since u CRed i like the turn c/c. river, i dont see what u could beat?

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Villian is 19/8.4/1/11 over 1400 hands. In his notes i have written "very weak passive, calls down light, bets light when checked to"

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Turn check enables you to get outplayed later in the hand. I'd rather bet the turn and fold the river UI then check the turn and fold the river UI since you might be able to get value from a weaker hand and also might avoid getting outplayed for the possible times it occurs.