QJo against maniac

[Befolder]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Grunch...

Fold pre-flop. Ugh, that flop sucks.

[/ QUOTE ]

Even getting 6/1 in the BB we should fold?

[/ QUOTE ]

I would even with the odds our hand doesn't hold up very well here. It is also very tricky to play when you end up flopping something like TP.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks. I'll have to start observing how these type of hands are doing for me. I'm probably all too willing to call w/ any two broadways from the BB after a raise, less so if the raise is in EP though.

[Burning_K]

[ QUOTE ]
i hate QJo. absolutely hate it.

I think I 3 bet to try and isolate the LAG. if mp1 calls that, I doubt I'd invest any more money in this hand.

[/ QUOTE ]

If you 3bet and mp1/mp3 calls, you check turn and it's 1 bet back to you after any action, you'd have the pot odds to call to hit the gutshot (maybe another Q) no?

[HighOctane]

Fold. you have 6 outs (2 Queens, 4 9s - J will make nut straight for AK). You are getting a little less than 7:1 to see the next card and the pot is offereing 5.75:1. Implied odds would get you there but the problem is you still have the UTG limper and the preflop raiser yet to act behind you.

[Smarazza]

Me and my sweater have decided for the 3-bet (maybe he'll reply to this post to point out his reasons)

Poker Stars
Limit Holdem Ring game
Limit: $1/$2
10 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (10 players) Hero is BB with Q[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]
2 folds, UTG+2 calls, <font color="#cc0000">MP1 raises</font>, MP2 folds, MP3 calls, 3 folds, Hero calls <font color="aaaaaa">(6.5:1)</font>, UTG+2 calls.

Flop: 8[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] Q[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (8.5SB, 4 players)
Hero checks, UTG+2 checks, <font color="#cc0000">MP1 bets</font>, <font color="#cc0000">MP3 raises</font>, <font color="#cc0000">Hero 3-bets</font>, 2 folds, <font color="#cc0000">MP3 caps</font>, Hero calls <font color="aaaaaa">(16.5:1)</font>.

Turn: 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] (8.75BB, 2 players)
Hero??

What's the strategy now?
What's villain's range of hands after the cap? (Useless?)

[Befolder]

Since you got the most maniacal of them left, I'd probably want to get to the river as cheap as possible, c/c on both streets unless your straight comes in on the river.

I'm not feeling comfortable with my hand though.

[Riku]

Why not just donk the flop ?

[Xylocain]

:g:

Fold pre-flop like... everytime.

I don't think MP1 and MP3 look that crazy pre-flop with pfr 10-12 they just play to many hands.

I would rarely play this hand even against a true mainiac You are quite likely to pay off a gazillion bets if you flop a marginal hand while they may very well decide to fold if they flop nothing. Besides, you will get a better hand soon anyway, they wont notice... thats why they're mainiacs [img]/images/graemlins/laugh.gif[/img]

Edit: Then there were some post preflop stuff... donk the flop and the hand will play differently. If you get raised call (fold for two) and call down.

[Shillx]

3-bet is the worst option on the flop imo

[censored] didn't see the straight draw. Coldcall for sure.

[Smarazza]

[ QUOTE ]
I don't think MP1 and MP3 look that crazy pre-flop with pfr 10-12 they just play to many hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

10% of 60% aren't a lot of hands? (Standard is something around 15-20/7-10)

[ QUOTE ]
didn't see the straight draw. Coldcall for sure.

[/ QUOTE ]

With the cold call PrfR will stay in (or 3-bet). If we want to play this isn't better the 3-bet? (Whit this I don't want to support my line)

[davelin]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I don't think MP1 and MP3 look that crazy pre-flop with pfr 10-12 they just play to many hands.

[/ QUOTE ]

10% of 60% aren't a lot of hands? (Standard is something around 15-20/7-10)

[/ QUOTE ]

It's 10% of all hands played. So someone with a 60/10 set of stats has approximately the same raising range as someone with 20/10 set of stats.