Pokerstars RNG (not a rigged post)

[jackaaron]

Again, I'm in no way claiming Stars is rigged. I actually don't get any more bad beats there than anywhere else I play...anyhow...

My question is how is there RNG used? I know that's pretty general...is there an RNG for each and every table? Or is there one RNG for the whole site? And, which would be better?

I'm wondering if high traffic amongst the tournies, and cash games could "alter" expected results?

I ask because I have a few friends that recently w/d all their money, and left Stars, and they say it's not rigged, but they think it could be screwed up because they get 3x as many bad beats there as any other place. I tell them not to focus on results, they say "Go F yourself, this is been happening for an entire year." I can't argue with them as I see them getting dogged my more one, two and three outters than imagineable over the course of about 12 months.

[zgall1]

This is not a rigged post? Right...

[jman220]

YFSSCKT

[jackaaron]

I mean, I'm not accusing them of being rigged. I don't think they are.

It's just a simple question, why do 2+2ers flame more than any other forum? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

[Skipbidder]

[ QUOTE ]
I mean, I'm not accusing them of being rigged. I don't think they are.

It's just a simple question, why do 2+2ers flame more than any other forum? [img]/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]

It might be because you said that you were not making a post about Stars being rigged and then made a post about Stars being rigged.

[mackem]

How come there are more Stars rigged posts than Party?

[miajag]

From Pokerstars.com:

SHUFFLE

"Anyone who considers arithmetic methods of producing random digits is, of course, in a state of sin." - John von Neumann, 1951

We understand that a use of a fair and unpredictable shuffle algorithm is critical to our software. To ensure this and avoid major problems described in [2], we are using two independent sources of truly random data:

* user input, including summary of mouse movements and events timing, collected from client software
* true hardware random number generator developed by Intel [3], which uses thermal noise as an entropy source

Each of these sources itself generates enough entropy to ensure a fair and unpredictable shuffle.

Shuffle Highlights:

* A deck of 52 cards can be shuffled in 52! ways. 52! is about 2225. We use 249 random bits from both entropy sources (user input and thermal noise) to achieve an even and unpredictable statistical distribution.
* Furthermore, we apply conservative rules to enforce the required degree of randomness; for instance, if user input does not generate required amount of entropy, we do not start the next hand until we obtain the required amount of entropy from Intel RNG.
* We use the SHA-1 cryptographic hash algorithm to mix the entropy gathered from both sources to provide an extra level of security
* We also maintain a SHA-1-based pseudo-random generator to provide even more security and protection from user data attacks
* To convert random bit stream to random numbers within a required range without bias, we use a simple and reliable algorithm. For example, if we need a random number in the range 0-25:
o we take 5 random bits and convert them to a random number 0-31
o if this number is greater than 25 we just discard all 5 bits and repeat the process
* This method is not affected by biases related to modulus operation for generation of random numbers that are not 2n, n = 1,2,..
* To perform an actual shuffle, we use another simple and reliable algorithm:
o first we draw a random card from the original deck (1 of 52) and place it in a new deck - now original deck contains 51 cards and the new deck contains 1 card
o then we draw another random card from the original deck (1 of 51) and place it on top of the new deck - now original deck contains 50 cards and the new deck contains 2 cards
o we repeat the process until all cards have moved from the original deck to the new deck
* This algorithm does not suffer from "Bad Distribution Of Shuffles" described in [2]



PokerStars shuffle verified by Cigital and BMM International

In May 2003, PokerStars submitted extensive information about the PokerStars random number generator (RNG) to two independent organizations. We asked these two trusted resources to perform an in-depth analysis of the randomness of the output of the RNG, and its implementation in the shuffling of the cards on PokerStars.

Both independent companies were given full access to the source code and confirmed the randomness and security of our shuffle. Click here for more details.

[Hornacek]

YSSCKY.

[Miggo]

[ QUOTE ]
52! is about 2225.

[/ QUOTE ]

On what planet did they get this from? Must be a typo in their document. Isn't this around 8e+67 or 8 quadgazillionbillion or so?

[OrangeKing]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
52! is about 2225.

[/ QUOTE ]

On what planet did they get this from? Must be a typo in their document. Isn't this around 8e+67 or 8 quadgazillionbillion or so?

[/ QUOTE ]

I'm taking a wild guess and saying that the number didn't correctly translate when pasted into the 2+2 forums.