Methods used to determine calling ranges

[holdem17]

After practicing bubble play on some bubble trainers and messing around with SNGPT I have become decent at bubble decisions. But these decisions are assuming you know the exact range of the opponents. Since this variable is a huge factor in push/fold decisions, I am curious as to how everyone goes about putting villains on calling ranges. What default calling ranges you use on unknowns. I know there are countless scenarios and variables that factor in but I am curious about peoples thoughts on this.

How much do calling ranges tighten or loosen:

as buyins go up?
as the number of pushes you make go up?

there are a number of other questions to add here...

Also another aspect that I have been thinking about is how limpers affect push/fold

[TwistedEcho]

Well you can run PT when you play so you get preflop stats, its not perfect but someone who has played 60/10/3 is more likely to call you than a 6/6/3.

Obviously the lower buyin the tournament the more they call, although the higher buyins people call more too. Basically at the lowest buyins people suck and think JT is a good hand to call with, the middle stakes people tighten up and realise they should be folding tons, and the highest stakes people realise everyone is pushing tons, so can call light.

Also the more you push the more likely someone will look you up, the worse your image is the more likely they will call. people don't like being pushed around and obviously the more you push, the bigger your hand range is for players who actually take notice.

[holdem17]

Another thing I meant to add...

How does your stack size affect calling ranges?

[jukofyork]

[ QUOTE ]
Another thing I meant to add...

How does your stack size affect calling ranges?

[/ QUOTE ]
Look through your own hands (or mine some if you don't have many). Fo example, see what happens when you have a certain stack and push from the SB. Then see what happens if you've pushed the last time, etc.

If you want to try to qualify the results in %s, then one thing you can try is to first convert each of the K/S rankings into a percentage. Then every-time you see a player call your push in a certain situation that you are examining, write down the %-rank. Finally after getting lots of these find the mean and double it. EG:

Average donk / called SB push with effective stack of 8BB / 1st SB->BB push : 10%, 8%, 9%, 20%, 13%, 5%, 2%, 8%, ...

(10+8+9+20+13+5+2+8)/8=9.375%, 9.375*2 = 18.75%

So you can now assume that if he is using the K/S ranking system and only calling the top N% vs you, the cut-off he is using is about top 19% of hands (this should also give you a rough and ready idea about your fold equity too). You need quite alot of data to do this though, but you should get some idea (perhaps +/- 5%) of calling range %'s in different situations by trying it out.

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[holdem17]

[ QUOTE ]

If you want to try to qualify the results in %s, then one thing you can try is to first convert each of the K/S rankings into a percentage. Then every-time you see a player call your push in a certain situation that you are examining, write down the %-rank. Finally after getting lots of these find the mean and double it. EG:

Average donk / called SB push with effective stack of 8BB / 1st SB->BB push : 10%, 8%, 9%, 20%, 13%, 5%, 2%, 8%, ...

(10+8+9+20+13+5+2+8)/8=9.375%, 9.375*2 = 18.75%

So you can now assume that if he is using the K/S ranking system and only calling the top N% vs you, the cut-off he is using is about top 19% of hands (this should also give you a rough and ready idea about your fold equity too). You need quite alot of data to do this though, but you should get some idea (perhaps +/- 5%) of calling range %'s in different situations by trying it out.

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]


Why double it?

[jukofyork]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]

If you want to try to qualify the results in %s, then one thing you can try is to first convert each of the K/S rankings into a percentage. Then every-time you see a player call your push in a certain situation that you are examining, write down the %-rank. Finally after getting lots of these find the mean and double it. EG:

Average donk / called SB push with effective stack of 8BB / 1st SB->BB push : 10%, 8%, 9%, 20%, 13%, 5%, 2%, 8%, ...

(10+8+9+20+13+5+2+8)/8=9.375%, 9.375*2 = 18.75%

So you can now assume that if he is using the K/S ranking system and only calling the top N% vs you, the cut-off he is using is about top 19% of hands (this should also give you a rough and ready idea about your fold equity too). You need quite alot of data to do this though, but you should get some idea (perhaps +/- 5%) of calling range %'s in different situations by trying it out.

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[/ QUOTE ]


Why double it?

[/ QUOTE ]
Because the average hand you observe them call with is in the very center of the distribution of hands they call. So if you see them calling with a top 5% hand on average, then their cut-off is top 10%, and if you see them call with a top 50% hand on average, their cut-off is top 100%, etc.

This assumes they use a simple binary threshold (call/don't call), but in practice (and especially if you are grouping player types together) the histogram would have an a S-shaped curve centered on the mean which signifies that sometimes they would call and sometimes they would not (no SNGPT like tool can handle these frequency distributions yet anyway...).

Juk [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[holdem17]

This seems interesting. Would anyone like to work on getting some % with me for different scenarios.