PLO 100 - can i pass at any point here??

[Elrazor]

players involved are all regular TAGs

Cryptologic
Pot Limit Omaha Ring game
Blinds: $0.50/$1
10 players
Converter

Pre-flop: (10 players) Hero is UTG+1 with 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] K[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img]
UTG folds, Hero calls, 3 folds, <font color="#cc0000">MP3 raises to $4.5</font>, CO calls, Button calls, BB calls, Hero calls.

Flop: T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] ($23, 6 players)
Button checks, <font color="#cc0000">BB bets $8</font>, <font color="#cc0000">Hero raises to $46.5</font>, MP3 folds, <font color="#cc0000">CO raises all-in $105</font>, 2 folds, Hero calls.

Turn: 9[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] ($241, 2 players + 1 all-in - Main pot: $241)


River: Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] ($241, 2 players + 1 all-in - Main pot: $241)


Results:
Final pot: $241

[Cezar]

I don't see the fold anywhere. Sometimes you're way ahead, sometimes splitting the pot and freerolling to 3 outs. In an absolute worst scenario, you're the one getting freerolled to 6 outs. You've already put 40% of your stack in, so getting freerolled is the lesser of two evils then folding.

[wazz]

I count 8 potential freeroll outs.

I often check-fold this.

[Cezar]

Ooops, there is the straight flush draw. The worst freeroll is 7 outs. A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]TJ. The villain can't have 4 cards with same boat, open-ended and 6 freeroll outs to a better boat.

According to cardplayer calculator, against A [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]Q [img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img]J [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img]T [img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] we have 60.49% ties, 8.66% wins and 30.85% losses.

May be I just suck at omaha, but I can't see check-folding this flop. We can't give a free card when ahead, which we are most of the time. Betting seems mandatory. And after the mandatory bet, the pot is too big and we have half the stack in. Stick the rest of the stack in, and keep the fingers crossed.

Is my sarcasm detector broken ?

[TheRempel]

Yeah sarcasm doesn't always play on the internet, though it should be
in the forum faq that anytime you flop the nut boat in PLO you shouldn't be folding the flop.

[glass_onion]

Seriously. Check-fold?

[Elrazor]

Sorry if this seem obvious, but at the moment i seem to be stuck in a rut. generally my sessions seem to go something like this. i play well and get $100 up. then i get a key hand like this and lose it all. Villan had AQJ10 and hit a Q on the river. Yesterday it was AAA v AA77, all in on the flop and i lost to a runner runner straight.

I wondered if i was doing something fundamentaly wrong in these kind of spots, or im just just unlucky [img]/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

[Poker monkey]

If you're unlucky, it's probably not a good idea be playing Omaha since there's a lot of luck involved.

[TrainHardDieHard]

Im pretty new to omaha. Are freeroll outs just extra outs someone has to beat the already best hand ?

[DonCologne]

If 2 people have the current nuts and one of them have a chance to get a better hand, he is freerolling.
He can wins the whole pot and in his worst case he gets half of the pot. The other people has no chance to improve and so his best case is 50% of the pot, and the worst case is 0%.

Example: J[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/spade.gif[/img] 7[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] 6[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] against A[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] J[img]/images/graemlins/club.gif[/img] T[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] A[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] on a Q[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 9[img]/images/graemlins/heart.gif[/img] 8[img]/images/graemlins/diamond.gif[/img] flop.

The first hand has no chance to improve and the second hand can improve to a flush. So the pot equity is for hand 1: 30,18% and for hand 2: 69,82%.