Ask TheMetetron about living in or visiting Buenos Aires

[TheMetetron]

I've got too many PM's the last few days asking about it, so if I'm going to answer all of these questions I mine as well do it in public so I don't have to repeat myself and so everyone can benefit from it.

Types of things I'll answer:

- Different neighborhoods: cost, feel, safety, things to do in each
- Argentine culture and history
- Visas
- Other cities in Argentina besides BsAs and things to do in them
- How to find an apartment
- Getting around the city and to/from the airport
- Language questions and questions about tango classes
- Cost of living and Argentine currency
- Nightlife: bars and nightclubs
- Restaurants, sidewalk cafes, delivery
- Theatre: tango shows, opera, plays, musicals, symphonies
- Sights to see, markets to visit
- Weather, seasons, etc
- Playing poker online here or questions about casinos here
- Pretty much anything else you want to ask about. Hookers, weed, whatever, I'm game for pretty much anything. I'm sure I've forgotten to mention some important stuff.

I'll start the thread off with some PMs I've received but feel free to add in your own questions. Keep in mind, I've only been here about 3 weeks now, but I did a ton of research before coming, I lived in a different country before this, and I have friends here who have lived here for more than a year... if I don't know the answer I can promise to find out for you. Perhaps some of the other 2+2 BsAs will show up from time to time.

[TheMetetron]

Question from anonymous:

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... what brought you to argentina? argentina seems liek a great place to me because it's spanish speaking which is what i'm learning, it sounds like it has all the culture and cool stuff of the US or europe, but is cheap, and different and latin american at the same time. do you know anything about language schools in buenos aires, or even colleges (is it hard for an american with bad grades like myself) to get it? and finally, have you learned the tango down there??? oh actually finally, argentina is super cool because they're so big on soccer too, how does that work for you?

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My answer:

I came to Argentina for pretty much the reasons you stated. Winter in Sweden was getting a bit too cold for my tastes and I was getting a bit bored with the small town I was living in. I wanted to move back to a big city and I was really looking to something Spanish speaking. Spain was going to be pretty damn hard and I'd already done the Europe thing. Buenos Aires just had everything come together for it: easy visa requirements, Spanish speaking, very cheap cost of living, lots of expats to help as a support network, tons of world-class theatre (opera, symphonies, musicals, play), beautiful women, one of the best nightlifes in the entire world, beautiful Euro-inspired architecture, temperate weather, lots of variety like California (skiing, glaciers, awesome beaches, big wine country, etc), as well as the fact that it was summer instead of a cold ass winter .

A 2+2er friend of mine is actually a part owner of a language school out here that also has a really good tango instructor that is usually really good at pulling in lots of girls for the classes, but he recently had knee surgery so I'm not sure how long he is out of commission.

Language school are generally pretty easy to get started on if you give them a few days notice. You can get private classes for $8-10 per hour with an instructor to work the hours you want and on what you want. It's the best way to go because you move much faster than with a group class and you can always get lessons tailored to you (for example... I want to learn how to order at a restaurant or how to pick up on girls or how to get my laundry done, etc). However, if you want to save a bit of money you can do group classes for $4-6 per hour with a class size of 2-5 depending on how many people are near your level. You can take as few or as many classes as you'd like. I currently take 2 hours a day, 5 days a week of private classes. If you are only here for a week and wanted to maximize your learning you could do 4 hours.

One other thing to keep in mind is that the Spanish here is slightly different. There are really only two big differences. First, the city of Buenos Aires (along with Uruguay) the only places in the world to use the word "vos" instead of "tu". So instead of "tu eres" it is "vos sos". Tu is still used in the possessive and most of the regular verb conjugations stay the same, but other irregulars change like "tu tienes" becoming "vos tenes" or "tu quieres" becoming "vos queres". The teachers here obviously know the tu form and will have no problem just teaching that to you if that is what you want, though the rest of the Spanish world will understand if you used vos for example... they'd just know you learned in BsAs; much like we'd know someone using British slang is from there.

The other difference is that the "ll" is not pronounced like an English "y" but rather like an English "sh". The Spanish "y" is also pronounced like the English "sh". Again, the teachers won't do that if that is what you want, but that is the way everyone speaks here, so "Yo", "calle", and "llamas" may sound weird to you at first. It doesn't take long to get used to though.

Then there are also some slang words or words that are different. "Che" is used a lot as a polite way of getting someones attention if you don't know their name and also seems to have extended into a friendly term among friends (and a joke to US expats). Words that are different include "heladera" instead of "refrigerador" and other things like that which can be sort of confusing the first time.

As for tango, I personally haven't taken classes yet, but I believe they are around the price of group Spanish classes and possibly even cheaper (since the class sizes are usually larger, though there are 2 instructors). So I'd expect $3-6/hr for tango classes to be average. If you are going to be here a long time it's something you have to do a the very least as a way to meet girls or other people.

They are very big on soccer and if you are here during soccer season (Feb-June) or (August-Dec) and they are playing you have to go to a Boca Juniors game which is apparently an experience unlike anything you'll ever see. There are also some young twenty-something expats who get together for pick-up games of soccer on I think Mondays and if you speak Spanish and make friends pretty much everyone plays soccer sometime. Unfortunately due to my injury it's hard for me to run so I haven't gotten into it yet but I'm hopeful.

Useful Links:

Academy Recoleta - Run by Juan and a 2+2 friend, it has Spanish classes (private and group) and tango classes. This is where I go and pay $10/hr for private lessons.

Interhispanica - Another academy in the Recoleta neighborhood that has Spanish classes. No tango here though. I believe private classes are $8-9/hr.

[TheMetetron]

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Hi Met,

Thanks again for the info. If you don't mind, I have another set of near daily questions for you

Just looking at the ByT Argentina site, it seems as if the Palermo district is a little more "suburby" than downtown. Is it possible I could find a house with a yard in this area to rent? Are you aware of other places in Argentina that are low in crime but more like suburbs or rural? Do you know a good leasing agent I could take to to discuss various housing options? I think I would like the big city but having a dog may make it difficult.

Also, any advice on the best way to learn Spanish quickly? I took a couiple of years in high school so I probably remember some of the basics.

If I make it down to BA I'd definately like to buy you some beers for all your help

Thanks

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First of all, you don't want to live downtown (Recoleta is not downtown). Ideally you probably want to live in Recoleta, Palermo, Belgrano, or Barrio Norte. I'd stick with Recoleta and maybe Palermo when you first move here and the consider relocating later.

Palermo isn't suburby and Recoleta has more open park spaces, but it IS possible to find some places in Palermo with a small yard which is impossible to do in Recoleta. Recoleta is more 6 story and higher apartments with restricted entry and a doorman. Palermo is more 2-3 stories and don't have such things and things are definitely a lot more spread out there than in Recoleta. I can't give you exact information but I did go to a party last weekend at a nice 2 story, 2-bedroom condo with a decent sized backyard (by city standards) in Palermo and they are paying about what I am for a 1 bedroom in Recoleta. Not sure where they found it or I'd try to point you in the right direction.

As for other cities in Argentina, the farthest out you probably want to go is some of the nicer actual suburbs of Buenos Aires. I wouldn't move to other parts of the country. Unfortunately, it's city life for me so I don't know anything about the suburbs.

There aren't really leasing agents for foreigners. You can't get an actual lease because you need a guarantor, therefore you can of stick with getting fleeced by the furnished rentals (though if you shop around it's not so bad).

As for learning Spanish, I sort of answered the question above. I'd recommend 10 hours a week of private instruction. I took three years in high school as well and after one week I'm already back to stuff I was learning in the middle to end of my second year. It comes back pretty quickly, but the biggest hurdle is speaking and understanding people, as well as building a large vocabulary to allow you to get around.

Beers are always appreciated, though at $2.50 for a 3L pitcher, I think you could part with more than a few [img]/images/graemlins/wink.gif[/img]

[Jigsaws]

Have you been to an asado yet? Have you had the steaks? Have you gone out clubbing? Can I come visit when I return to BA this summer?

As for Boca Juniors: try getting in with a local, and try getting into the stands with all the hardcore fans. If I remember correctly, they're on the north side of the stadium.

[TheMetetron]

For fun, here are some random pictures that I either took or got from online of Buenos Aires and Argentina.


This is my apartment in Buenos Aires. Not pictured are a kitchen, bedroom, bathroom, and balcony.


The street I live on. As you can see it doesn't feel like you are going to die.


The Teatro Colon. It's the national theatre and has it's own orchestra, ballet company, opera group, and is home to many other events. Unfortunately, it is closed for renovation until the end of the year in preparation for its 100th anniversary. All productions were moved elsewhere.


Teatro Colon at night. Beautiful shot.


Casa Rosada, the presidential palace of Argentina


Avenida 9 de Julio. I admit it's an artistic shot, but it's all I have. The widest street in the world.


Plaza Once Subway Station


No idea where this is but it shows some of the open spaces.


Puerto Madero


Rush hour


I'll post more later.

[TheMetetron]

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Have you been to an asado yet? Have you had the steaks? Have you gone out clubbing? Can I come visit when I return to BA this summer?

As for Boca Juniors: try getting in with a local, and try getting into the stands with all the hardcore fans. If I remember correctly, they're on the north side of the stadium.

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, an Argentine friend had an Asado. He did a wonderful job and I actually think that was my 2nd or 3rd night in Buenos Aires so it was a good way to start it off.

I eat lots of steak, almost everytime I go out somewhere. Bife de Chorizo is awesome. It's pretty hard to not have a steak here unless you are trying to be different.

I've been to Opera Bay twice, but unfortunately no other clubs than that as most of my friends seem to prefer bars. I've been to more bars than I can remember or find again though. Anyone can come visit, but its summer now.

I know, I'm trying to get a group together to go when they start playing in a month and a half.

[MicroBob]

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"Che" is used a lot as a polite way of getting someones attention if you don't know their name and also seems to have extended into a friendly term among friends

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Sounds pretty much like the equivilent of the American-english, "Dude." Or even, "Hey Man."


nice pics. Looks awesome.


Pretty flowers on your coffee-table.


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It's pretty hard to not have a steak here unless you are trying to be different.


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Friend of mine is a lawyer for a human-rights group and travels to various Latin American countries a lot.
He's also a vegetarian.
He mentioned that he loved Buenos Aries in his 3 or 4 visits there but mentioned the steak obesession as being a significant obstacle for him. He gets away with eating fish some of the time. Other times even that isn't even an option and he's stuck with rice and potato or something.

[mason55]

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Spain was going to be pretty damn hard

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Can you explain what you mean by this?

[TheMetetron]

[ QUOTE ]
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"Che" is used a lot as a polite way of getting someones attention if you don't know their name and also seems to have extended into a friendly term among friends

[/ QUOTE ]


Sounds pretty much like the equivilent of the American-english, "Dude." Or even, "Hey Man."

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Sort of. Boludo is more like "dude" between friends, but unlike Che is calling someone an idiot if its someone you don't know. Apparently, "Che boludo, que paso?" is common among friends.

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[ QUOTE ]
It's pretty hard to not have a steak here unless you are trying to be different.


[/ QUOTE ]

Friend of mine is a lawyer for a human-rights group and travels to various Latin American countries a lot.
He's also a vegetarian.
He mentioned that he loved Buenos Aries in his 3 or 4 visits there but mentioned the steak obesession as being a significant obstacle for him. He gets away with eating fish some of the time. Other times even that isn't even an option and he's stuck with rice and potato or something.

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Yeah, I know a vegetarian who lives here and she claims it isn't as hard as I would think it is. There is even an organic, vegetarian restaurant here in town that is supposed to be amazing. She has started eating fish once in a while though to make it easier at some restaurants and also I assume to get the necessary protein.

[TheMetetron]

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Spain was going to be pretty damn hard

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Can you explain what you mean by this?

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Getting residency in Spain is pretty damn impossible. If you don't have residency it's going to be hard to live in any Schengen country.