Strange ruling at Tulalip regarding "single-chip rule"

[dtbog]

So I went to Tulalip for the first time last night, to check it out and see how live poker works in the Seattle area.

I'm sitting at a 3/5, $200 max game, and I'm in the big blind. The UTG player silently tosses out a green ($25) chip, and the dealer says "raise".

I'm not sure if UTG actually wants to raise, but I see this happen and I see the two players behind UTG sigh and prepare to fold. I quickly say "no no, dealer, I think he meant to call" before anyone inadvertently mucks their hand.

The dealer corrects me: "no, " he says, "that rule only applies in tournaments." I give him a confused look. "Oh, and in fixed-limit games."

I shake my head, but don't argue; I have no personal interest in the hand anyway. The player with the green chip had indeed wanted to raise, so everybody lets it go. The others at the table tell me that those are standard Washington State rules for NL* cash games.

Very curious, I wait until a break in the action and go check the rules posted on the wall. Sure enough, I was correct: the wall states that a single chip counts as a "call" unless the player specifically announces, "raise".

It's a new down now, but I ask the new dealer about it and she gives me an ambiguous response (indicating that she doesn't know.) I mention what it says on the wall, and she nods.

On the next down, I ask the next dealer during an uneventful hand what HE would do if this happened and someone wanted to actually enforce the player's action as a call.

He says he doesn't know either. While we're discussing it, the dealer from the previous down comes over saying that she's talked to the floor manager. Apparently, these rules on the wall are outdated (by at least two years) to the days before they had no-limit games... and the last rule on the wall indeed does say "floor manager has final discretion"... so they didn't feel the need to update the rules on the wall.

Is this totally bogus? Have you ever heard of a cardroom that has outdated and blatantly incorrect rules posted on the wall for more than a couple of days?

Also, what the hell? Why would any poker room manager specifically stipulate that this rule applies in tournaments and fixed-limit cash games, but not in NL?

~~~~
* yes, i know, it's spread-limit and not NL in WA. we don't need to have a thread about it [img]/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

[Ray Zee]

terrible for a joint to have the wrong rules on the wall. shows complete incompetence on someones part.
but the right waqy to play poker is if someone puts in the pot the ampount of a raise or more than that amount the bet stands. in limit they use the one chip rule but thats okay as it leads to miscommunications. but in no limit if you put in more than the raise or the exact amount of one it should be a raise unless you clearly state otherwise.

[Thythe]

I'm confused, are you saying that if you are playing $1/$2 NL for example and throw in a $100 chip without saying anything that it should be considered a raise?

[AThermopyle]

[ QUOTE ]
I'm confused, are you saying that if you are playing $1/$2 NL for example and throw in a $100 chip without saying anything that it should be considered a raise?

[/ QUOTE ]

[driverseati]

That seems strange. I thought it was standard for the call to stand when an oversized chip is placed in the pot and intention is not announced.

[Rick Nebiolo]

[ QUOTE ]
terrible for a joint to have the wrong rules on the wall. shows complete incompetence on someones part.
but the right waqy to play poker is if someone puts in the pot the ampount of a raise or more than that amount the bet stands. in limit they use the one chip rule but thats okay as it leads to miscommunications. but in no limit if you put in more than the raise or the exact amount of one it should be a raise unless you clearly state otherwise.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ray,

In all the games I've played in LA (up to 5/10 blind NL) any lead bet with a single over-sized chip stands as the amount of the chip. But when throwing in (without saying raise) a single over-sized chip when faced with a bet (player was UTG before the flop in the OP so he was faced with a bet equal to the amount of the BB) the action is always interpreted as a call.

Where is it done differently?

~ Rick

[dalerobk]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
terrible for a joint to have the wrong rules on the wall. shows complete incompetence on someones part.
but the right waqy to play poker is if someone puts in the pot the ampount of a raise or more than that amount the bet stands. in limit they use the one chip rule but thats okay as it leads to miscommunications. but in no limit if you put in more than the raise or the exact amount of one it should be a raise unless you clearly state otherwise.

[/ QUOTE ]

Ray,

In all the games I've played in LA (up to 5/10 blind NL) any lead bet with a single over-sized chip stands as the amount of the chip. But when throwing in (without saying raise) a single over-sized chip when faced with a bet (player was UTG before the flop in the OP so he was faced with a bet equal to the amount of the BB) the action is always interpreted as a call.

Where is it done differently?

~ Rick

[/ QUOTE ]

That's how it is done in every casino NL game I've ever played in. In fact, often people throw out one green chip intending to raise but since they didn't declare it the dealer will declare it as a call and not a raise. The room you were in just sounds like a poorly-run room--in almost every way. I mean for God's sake, every dealer should be aware of what the rules are, especially a basic one like that. That they don't is a reflection of bad management.

[booger]

In Indiana, preflop first to act throws in a single oversized chip without announcing raise it is a call of the big blind. Postflop oversized chip of first to act is a bet. Sounds like Tulalip staff needs some training and organization.

[pc in NM]

Last week, in New Mexico ($2/$5 NLE), I intended to raise, had several $5 chips, and put out a $100 bill without saying anything - the dealer enforced a call of a $20 bet....

[AKQJ10]

Maybe they could make not having enough small chips a felony.