Internet Poker... doomed from Day 1 - Page 9

Gregatron · #81 04-11-2006, 06:46 PM

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PT doesn't make any decisions for you. Poker bots do. Is this distinction really that hard for you to make?

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No but you don't understand. Not EVERYONE uses PT. Some people don't know about it. Others can't afford it.

Damn, gotta get rid of my independent music collection now. And my car. [censored]!

hotsauce615 · #82 04-11-2006, 06:58 PM

I guess it just depends on how you look at it. Someone made the point that the internet has different rules, and that makes tremendous amounts of sense. The thing is that it seems unfair that someone is not at my table and a program is data-mining my playing. They then take that information to use it to their advantage. I don't know, it seems obvious that it's working outside the confines of what a single person can do.

MrMoo · #83 04-11-2006, 07:02 PM

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PT doesn't make any decisions for you. Poker bots do. Is this distinction really that hard for you to make?

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So what if I write some software which programatically analyzes 1000 different game states, makes some mathematical calculations then in a pretty blue HUD displays something like "Fold: 0% Call: 15% Raise: 85%"? It's not making decisions for me, just giving me information I couldn't have figured out on my own. Is it legal because the poker sites haven't deemed it an "unfair advantage" yet? If I don't release it to anyone and poker site X never knows about it, is it still fair? What if I think it's fair and you don't? Does it become fair once I release it for everyone else to use as well?

The reason so many people are arguing in this thread is that the morality of using software to help your game comes down to everyones opinion.

MrMoo · #84 04-11-2006, 07:09 PM

Is it so hard to believe that someone else could have a different opinion than you? He thinks Poker Tracker is unfair. Is that cause for you to belittle him with sarcasm just because you don't agree? Just because he has an unpopular opinion doesn't mean it's wrong.

jb9 · #85 04-11-2006, 07:13 PM

Meh, if you enjoy being an ignorant twit, knock yourself out.

As I'm sure you noticed, I was not arguing to ban poker tracker but trying to explain why *some* people (not including me, by the way) have a problem with it. You see no difference between books and software tools. Some people think there is a huge difference.

If you prefer to not understand this or to pretend to not understand this, that is your decision.

Gregatron · #86 04-11-2006, 07:16 PM

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Is it so hard to believe that someone else could have a different opinion than you? He thinks Poker Tracker is unfair. Is that cause for you to belittle him with sarcasm just because you don't agree? Just because he has an unpopular opinion doesn't mean it's wrong.

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My response commented on the poster's logic, not his opinion. But speaking of opinions, contrary to the hippy pc logic you seem to espouse, not everyone's opinion is equally valid, esp if it is based on flawed logic. We are not all special little snowflakes. Some opinions are stupid and wrong.

betadecay · #87 04-11-2006, 07:19 PM

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[ QUOTE ]
PT doesn't make any decisions for you. Poker bots do. Is this distinction really that hard for you to make?

[/ QUOTE ]

So what if I write some software which programatically analyzes 1000 different game states, makes some mathematical calculations then in a pretty blue HUD displays something like "Fold: 0% Call: 15% Raise: 85%"? It's not making decisions for me, just giving me information I couldn't have figured out on my own. Is it legal because the poker sites haven't deemed it an "unfair advantage" yet? If I don't release it to anyone and poker site X never knows about it, is it still fair? What if I think it's fair and you don't? Does it become fair once I release it for everyone else to use as well?

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Poker sites have clauses in there TnC's about things like this. They are not allowed. Their clauses remain ambigious such as party's "any software that gives unfair advantage over others". There is not specific software named but your hypothetical program would fall under this clause and there for be illegal and unethical regardless of opinions.

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The reason so many people are arguing in this thread is that the morality of using software to help your game comes down to everyones opinion.

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No it doesn't. It comes down to a site's TnC's. Certain sites allow datamining, PT, Huds, ETC.... Other sites do not. There is no grey area where opinions sway the issue one way or the other.

jb9 · #88 04-11-2006, 07:21 PM

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um, if you cant afford $55, then how can you afford $200, when it is almost a sure thing you will lose that money within a month or so?

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Um, it's not a question of "afford". If your poker bankroll is $200 and you are playing .5/1 and you give up 55 big bets on software you have greatly increased your risk of ruin even if the software improves your win rate.

By the way, there are plenty of people (including a high percentage of posters on this board) who could take $200 to the Party .5/1 tables and not go broke in a month or so.

bobbyi · #89 04-11-2006, 07:23 PM

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(I do not use ANY program)

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Me either. I connect to Party's servers directly using the power of mind. It's tiring, but at least I can sleep well afterwrds knowing I didn't have an unfair advantage.

jb9 · #90 04-11-2006, 07:35 PM

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My response commented on the poster's logic, not his opinion. But speaking of opinions, contrary to the hippy pc logic you seem to espouse, not everyone's opinion is equally valid, esp if it is based on flawed logic.

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Flawed logic?

Like conflating someone's actual statements (e.g., about software) with a different concept (e.g., books)? Or assuming from statements someone made that they were actually proposing an argument and then proceeding to attack the argument you imagined into existence using logical fallacies that you try to pass off as sound logic...