Poker In Colorado?

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I have been hearing rumors about increasing limits as long as there has been gambling in Colorado. Unfortunately, the $5 limit is in the state Constitution, so getting it changed requires a referendum, which can be introduced either by petition or by a 2/3 vote of both houses of the legislature. Every measure to expand gambling since the one that put the "limited gaming" in Blackhawk, Central City and Cripple Creek has lost, so the casinos don't seem to want to spend the advertising bucks to try to get anything passed. After all, the $5 limit has little effect on slots, which is their main cash cow. They have been more than willing to spend money to defeat measures that would bring in competition, most recently a measure a few years ago that would have allowed "Video Lottery Terminals" (crappy slot machines) at racetracks. It was pretty amusing. Lots of ads, funded mostly by casinos, about how terrible more gambling would be.

[CincyLady]

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My friend would be betting the crap out of the hand, and sure enough, she'd get her belly buster straight, or runner runner flush on the river.

She'd then tip the dealer big, and on to the next hand.

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This isn't collusion.

edit: Also, similar.

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It was happening time after time after time, too often for simple happenstance.

[CORed]

If you're coming from south Metro Denver,6th ave. to I-70 to Central City Parkway is best. North Metro Denver, I-70 to CO 58 TO 6 TO 119 is best. From Boulder, 93 to 6 to 119 is best. 119 to Nederland to Blackhawk is also feasible from Boulder. It will take longer than 93, but is very scenic.

119 and 6 are twisty, two lane canyon roads, that can be really scary when icy, with occasional rock slides (I had one come down right in front of me once. A few seconds earlier and best case it would have trashed my car, worst case killed me).

[gutte169]

I have played in nearly every western state (WA, OR, CA, CO, MT), and Colorado is by far the worst. The gambling laws are completely backwards. The majority of the regulars are the type of people who should definetly not be gambling. The $5 max bet is the equivalent of a state lottery which is just a tax on poor, stupid people.

If you go, which I would not recommend, be prepared for $5 rakes, people tipping $3-$4 a hand, and enough degenerates to make you feel uncomfortable the whole time.

Don't go. Find or start a fun home game. It's a waste of gas money and time.

[CORed]

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RR, it's common knowledge about the Asian coluders up there in Blackhawk

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Just like it's common knowledge that online poker is rigged, and that aces never hold up in a loose, low limit game.

While I agree that the English only rule should be enforced more strictly, I really don't think there's much collusion going on. It's just another excuse the fish use for why they are losing. Most of the Asian players are so bad that they would lose even if they were colluding. Complaining about the loose play is silly. It's the only thing that makes a low limit game with too much rake even marginally beatable. Yes, it makes for a lot of variance. That's why you need a bankroll.

[CincyLady]

You know if it's one or two or even three or four people, I'd agree with you.

However, the number of times I've heard about this, and what I've seen myself, not just in Blackhawk, but in Vegas as well, leads me to believe there are indeed teams of Asian players working with each other to colude against the rest of the table.

[jackhigh]

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RR, it's common knowledge about the Asian coluders up there in Blackhawk

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Just like it's common knowledge that online poker is rigged, and that aces never hold up in a loose, low limit game.

While I agree that the English only rule should be enforced more strictly, I really don't think there's much collusion going on. It's just another excuse the fish use for why they are losing. Most of the Asian players are so bad that they would lose even if they were colluding. Complaining about the loose play is silly. It's the only thing that makes a low limit game with too much rake even marginally beatable. Yes, it makes for a lot of variance. That's why you need a bankroll.

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Asian player gets pocket kings... he tells his buddy to cap it. Buddy helps him cap to the turn and MUCKS on last bet before cap on THE TURN (before river).

This my friend is collusion... and it happens all the time at The Lodge (actually this particular hand was at The Station when the three Asian buddy's sat in my 3-5 game and did this over and over again - I almost duked it out with one of them after he got pissed when I called him out)

Another time at the Lodge... an older Asian gent gave the old "thumbs up" to his buddy in the 5th seat and guess what Cap-u-chino... old man showed down Aces and won a huge pot.

Let me explain collusion plain and simple. If you tell or signal an accomplice to raise in order to build a pot for your big hand ITS COLLUSION!

When Whitey is not in the hand... I've seen flopped boats checked down to the river.

It happens way too much at The Lodge. The dealers know it, the management know it - if they say they don't they're either idiots or liars.

The Asians tip well and feed the slots so obviously there is a monetary incentive to keep them up there.

[jackhigh]

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RR, it's common knowledge about the Asian coluders up there in Blackhawk

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Just like it's common knowledge that online poker is rigged, and that aces never hold up in a loose, low limit game.

While I agree that the English only rule should be enforced more strictly, I really don't think there's much collusion going on. It's just another excuse the fish use for why they are losing. Most of the Asian players are so bad that they would lose even if they were colluding. Complaining about the loose play is silly. It's the only thing that makes a low limit game with too much rake even marginally beatable. Yes, it makes for a lot of variance. That's why you need a bankroll.

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Another thing... I'm getting tired of these "book read, tight game, low limit hold em internet geeks" saying how easy it would be to beat this game!

Tell you what... come on up to Colorado and take your shot fellas! There's gold in them thar hills!

The 5-5 games at The Lodge average $100-$200 a pot. It's ripe for the takin. Quit your jobs... move to Colorado and become a 5-5 pro! How much easier can it get! Take a 2 week vacation here and rake in the dough!

If these huge games are that beatable you'd have every smelly low limit grinder this side of the Mississippi campin out in pup tents next to Clear Creek in a matter of weeks - trying to get in these games. Guess what gents... it aint happening. 80-90% of the players in these games (usually 3-5 tables) are Asian - for a reason. Many a Whitey have tried to crack that nut (including myself) and all have failed.

So if you think you can do it... come on up, they'll be waiting with open arms and a Cap-u-chino... and YOU can be served up as the next Whitey Sandwich! [img]/images/graemlins/smirk.gif[/img]

[RR]

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Asian player gets pocket kings... he tells his buddy to cap it. Buddy helps him cap to the turn and MUCKS on last bet before cap on THE TURN (before river).

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This is where the games are protected. If it happens like this, this guy just laid 2:1 with his kings. Now if he signaled a partner to fold pocket queens while he had kings that would be tough to beat.

[mr.bum]

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there is a gross conflict of interest in this thread.
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alright. let me take a stab at this math as I understand it.

let the game be beatable at a winrate of x, where x = # of big bets/hour.

since the rake is capped at ~$7/pot (is this 10%?), let's assume an average rake of $5 per pot/no flop no drop.
assuming a dealing rate of 35 hands/hour, that's $175 coming out of circulation every hour out of $1750 total that's exchanging hands every hour.


although you can't calculate the true rake you are paying without your pots won/pots lost ratio, i highly doubt this game can be beaten; if it can, it's probably at 10bb/hour or more.

by all means, if there's someone out there with more math tricks, please correct me.

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the assumed numbers Furyion21 uses are on the conservative side.

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RR does this conservative math sound correct to you or not.please give reasons for your point of view.you have said and reiterated the poitnt that "these games are easily beatable". you have provided exactly zero evidence for your point of view.other than something that read like"um...im a mod and a gilpen floor who has played and won 5 times and know this to bet true...take my word for it.my intelect combined with my sample size are profound factual evidence BSBSBSBSBSProGilpenThisProGilpenThat..........."