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#71
08-25-2007, 03:21 AM
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Re: The And and the Blade of Grass
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[ QUOTE ] That whizzing you hear is the sound of the point sailing right past you. [/ QUOTE ] It isn't the point sailing past me, it's the logic, which I suspect sails past because it's illusory. Assertion logic isn't. [/ QUOTE ] he didn't quote dawkins' arguments, he quoted an introduction outlining the sort of arguments the book is intended to present. you keep asserting dawkins failure to make said arguments but, i believe, have not read the book and have no intention to do so. 
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#72
08-25-2007, 04:31 AM
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Re: The And and the Blade of Grass
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[ QUOTE ] So, I think Dawkins has always been pretty careful about this [/ QUOTE ] Why is it logical and rational to look at nature, see apparent purpose and design, and conclude non-design, and irrational to look at nature, see apparent purpose and design, and conclude design. That's the big gap of logic in people like Dawkins. [/ QUOTE ] The problem is that if you look at living things and see the wonderful and complex design [which they clearly have] and conclude that it has a designer, you haven't executed a logical step in your argument. You haven't learned anything, you've just postponed the question. You've merely entered an infinite regress, a trap of circular logic. This is because you cant turn your brain off [well some people can]. But you have to ask the next question, Who designed the designer? Once you are faced with this question, you must begin the whole argument from the beginning. If you chose to go the other way, and say, well it was God, then: 1. you've turned your brain off by ceasing to look for new questions, and new answers. 2. the conversation will end, and you're worldview will have become an unshakable dogma. you'll only be right because you know you're right, and not for any reasons of argument.
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#73
08-25-2007, 05:03 AM
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Re: The And and the Blade of Grass
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Why is it logical and rational to look at nature, see apparent purpose and design, and conclude non-design, and irrational to look at nature, see apparent purpose and design, and conclude design. That's the big gap of logic in people like Dawkins. [/ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Why is it logical and rational to look at the sun, see it moving across the sky, and conclude that it isn't moving, and irrational to look at the sun, see it moving across the sky, and conclude that it is moving. That's the big gap of logic in people like fixed sun believers. [/ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Why is it logical and rational to look at schizophrenics, see them acting like they're possessed by a demon, and conclude they're not possessed by a demon, and irrational to look at schizophrenics, see them acting like they're possessed by a demon, and conclude they're possessed by a demon. That's the big gap of logic in people like doctors. [/ QUOTE ] [ QUOTE ] Why is it logical and rational to look at those practising witchcraft, see them acting like they're witches, and conclude they're not witches, and irrational to look at those practicing witchcraft, see them acting like they're witches, and conclude they're witches. That's the big gap of logic in people like judges [/ QUOTE ] DO YOU GET IT? I don't think that you do. Cheers.
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#74
08-25-2007, 09:33 AM
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Re: The And and the Blade of Grass
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But you have to ask the next question, Who designed the designer? [/ QUOTE ] I promise you, when you come face to face with God at the last judgment, the last question that will come to your mind is "Who designed You?".
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#75
08-25-2007, 10:02 AM
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Re: The And and the Blade of Grass
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2. the conversation will end, and you're worldview will have become an unshakable dogma. you'll only be right because you know you're right, and not for any reasons of argument. [/ QUOTE ] But the conversation is never ending. NR could walk away from this message board sure in his own mind that he's right and not concern himself with us ever again. Yet he does not. I have to wonder how strong his faith really is if he feels the need to keep posting like this.
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#76
08-25-2007, 10:02 AM
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Re: The And and the Blade of Grass
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[ QUOTE ] But you have to ask the next question, Who designed the designer? [/ QUOTE ] I promise you, when you come face to face with God at the last judgment, the last question that will come to your mind is "Who designed You?". [/ QUOTE ] definitely will come to mind, hope I'd have the guts to ask. Wouldn't be top of my list though. what are you going to ask? chez
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#77
08-25-2007, 10:09 AM
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Re: The And and the Blade of Grass
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what are you going to ask? [/ QUOTE ] Why He ever bothered to even think about me, much less love me enough to include me in His Son's atonement for humanity.
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#78
08-25-2007, 10:10 AM
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Re: The And and the Blade of Grass
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[ QUOTE ] what are you going to ask? [/ QUOTE ] Why He ever bothered to even think about me, much less love me enough to include me in His Son's atonement for humanity. [/ QUOTE ] so even faced with god you're still going to assume you were right? not even going to ask? chez
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#80
08-25-2007, 10:19 AM
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Re: The And and the Blade of Grass
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[ QUOTE ] so even faced with god you're still going to assume you were right? not even going to ask? [/ QUOTE ] Right about what? [/ QUOTE ] about that son stuff
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