my first post minus well be controversial

[evanski]

Yay for the west coast.

[CheckRaise]

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from my small sample size of you guys and the guys i know from UMD, MN seems to have a higher EDIT:skill/'total players (at least mid limit winners)' ratio but UMD produced the few high high limit players who consistently win at those limits. ive yet to see great players from the schools OP listed (or can't think of any at the moment)

Barron

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You're not talking about Duluth are you?

[Lucky]

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Your logic is flawed, as for the truly genius world shakers of Yale and Harvard, poker is -ev and a waste of their time.
The smart ones (most all of them) recognize this quickly. While they surely have the potential to be the best players, to invest the time and effort to do so would almost surely be -EV. So why would Harvard students make -EV decisions? Maybe slight gambling prob, in which case their potential drops down a bit.

The truly great players should come from working/middle class backgrounds and public universities: Players with high IQ's, but with no lucrative connections/daddy's company they're passing on running after college to play poker.

Basically, for brilliant harvard guys, you're wasting your time with a -ev game like poker. Get your degree, become Senators, make millions on wall street etc

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I think you got your idea of the Ivy League out of a comic book or something. Ivy Leaguers ARE middle class. And they don't see poker as -EV compared to the working world whatsoever. I graduated from an Ivy. Did the I-banking thing for a while (internships) then management consulting after college. Poker is waaaaaay more lucrative. Thanks to poker I'm making as much as the Ivy grads with 12-14 years of consulting experience under their belts. All my Ivy buddies resent their desk-jockey lives immensely, and hope to emulate my entrepreneurial success themselves in some measure.

Can you be a senator or a Wall Street millionaire when you're 20-something? You have to put in a lifetime of effort into either, and even then it's far from a guarantee that you'll be successful all the way up. The typical Ivy grad who becomes a full-time employee and puts in 20 years of 60 hour workweeks ends up with a random/obscure management job in a Fortune 500 company making 300k a year, running the "development objectives" module of the "integrated initiatives" project or whatever... and that guy runs out his clock living a life of quiet desperation and complete obscurity, until retiring to FLA to watch TV all day.

My former colleagues at my places of employment, all of whom are educated at Ivy or equivalent schools, see my poker opportunity as something they would kill to be able to have... even the guys who are in their 30s with MBAs. Nobody wants to grind out 60 hours a week on utterly meaningless and passionless work, year in and year out, never getting much closer to achieving financial freedom.

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First, Harvard and Yale are different from other Ivy League schools.

Harvard and Yale matter. They have an impact on people all over the world. No one in England or Germany cares that you went to Brown or whatever.

And to spend 200k to go to the most prestigious university on the planet and then to sit in your apartment playing poker is ridiculous. You're Harvard classmates will run the world, and you're running over the party 30/60...when you're running good.

On the other hand, if you make 900k over the next 3 years and use that to fund an entrepreneurial endeavor, thats a different story.

[DcifrThs]

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[ QUOTE ]


from my small sample size of you guys and the guys i know from UMD, MN seems to have a higher EDIT:skill/'total players (at least mid limit winners)' ratio but UMD produced the few high high limit players who consistently win at those limits. ive yet to see great players from the schools OP listed (or can't think of any at the moment)

Barron

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You're not talking about Duluth are you?

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i dont know locations.

Barron

[bobhalford]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Your logic is flawed, as for the truly genius world shakers of Yale and Harvard, poker is -ev and a waste of their time.
The smart ones (most all of them) recognize this quickly. While they surely have the potential to be the best players, to invest the time and effort to do so would almost surely be -EV. So why would Harvard students make -EV decisions? Maybe slight gambling prob, in which case their potential drops down a bit.

The truly great players should come from working/middle class backgrounds and public universities: Players with high IQ's, but with no lucrative connections/daddy's company they're passing on running after college to play poker.

Basically, for brilliant harvard guys, you're wasting your time with a -ev game like poker. Get your degree, become Senators, make millions on wall street etc

[/ QUOTE ]

I think you got your idea of the Ivy League out of a comic book or something. Ivy Leaguers ARE middle class. And they don't see poker as -EV compared to the working world whatsoever. I graduated from an Ivy. Did the I-banking thing for a while (internships) then management consulting after college. Poker is waaaaaay more lucrative. Thanks to poker I'm making as much as the Ivy grads with 12-14 years of consulting experience under their belts. All my Ivy buddies resent their desk-jockey lives immensely, and hope to emulate my entrepreneurial success themselves in some measure.

Can you be a senator or a Wall Street millionaire when you're 20-something? You have to put in a lifetime of effort into either, and even then it's far from a guarantee that you'll be successful all the way up. The typical Ivy grad who becomes a full-time employee and puts in 20 years of 60 hour workweeks ends up with a random/obscure management job in a Fortune 500 company making 300k a year, running the "development objectives" module of the "integrated initiatives" project or whatever... and that guy runs out his clock living a life of quiet desperation and complete obscurity, until retiring to FLA to watch TV all day.

My former colleagues at my places of employment, all of whom are educated at Ivy or equivalent schools, see my poker opportunity as something they would kill to be able to have... even the guys who are in their 30s with MBAs. Nobody wants to grind out 60 hours a week on utterly meaningless and passionless work, year in and year out, never getting much closer to achieving financial freedom.

[/ QUOTE ]

First, Harvard and Yale are different from other Ivy League schools.

Harvard and Yale matter. They have an impact on people all over the world. No one in England or Germany cares that you went to Brown or whatever.

And to spend 200k to go to the most prestigious university on the planet and then to sit in your apartment playing poker is ridiculous. You're Harvard classmates will run the world, and you're running over the party 30/60...when you're running good.

On the other hand, if you make 900k over the next 3 years and use that to fund an entrepreneurial endeavor, thats a different story.

[/ QUOTE ]

I went to H and disagree with your two posts that make assumptions about H grads. I am not going to relate any personal stories, but just echo the other ivy grad who said that some people don't want to deal with the hassle of pursuing a professional career. I'm sure there are people out there that think someone has to be crazy to pass up the opportunity to get paid a bundle working on Wall St. after getting out of an ivy. I can understand that. But many do in fact avoid this path for a variety of reasons, most of which are stated above.

Many people also believe that a degree from H, Y, or P automatically guarantees a high paid job/career. That is simply not true.You also overestimate the extent to which the "old boy network" is in effect. For example, it's only a very small percentage of students that belong to finals clubs at H or eating clubs at P. Companies also don't hire based on where an applicant graduated from college. There are so many other factors they consider. However, when you are talking about top i-banking entry level positions, I agree that being an H grad makes all the difference. I would imagine that the top firms don't recruit beyond the top 3 schools.

H grads pursue a wide variety of careers, not just banking/consulting.There are enough interesting people going to these schools that not all of them go into business. There are many working in the arts, education,journalism, etc. I'm pursuing a career as a musician/teacher. Not all satisfying careers pay the big bucks. Generally they just pursue what makes them happy. I don't think poker is a "ridiculous" way to be happy. There are so many good things about being a poker player that even the overeducated ivy grads can get into it!

[Wayfare]

"Many people also believe that a degree from H, Y, or P automatically guarantees a high paid job/career. That is simply not true.You also overestimate the extent to which the "old boy network" is in effect. For example, it's only a very small percentage of students that belong to finals clubs at H or eating clubs at P."


I would estimate that least 40% of the Princeton undergraduate population belongs to an eating club at some point.

It's not going to make you money most of the time though.

[piki]

University of Ljubljana, for obvious reasons.

[CheckRaise]

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from my small sample size of you guys and the guys i know from UMD, MN seems to have a higher EDIT:skill/'total players (at least mid limit winners)' ratio but UMD produced the few high high limit players who consistently win at those limits. ive yet to see great players from the schools OP listed (or can't think of any at the moment)

Barron

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You're not talking about Duluth are you?

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i dont know locations.

Barron

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When you said UMD what school were you talking about?

[Biloxi]

There is a college poker championship. Buts its just a bunch of big ass tournaments with blinds moving fast. And its free to enter, so it cant count for much

[Case Closed]

omg western illinois is not there?