So it's 3 bets to me in the BB with A8o....I cap

[Jiggymike]

This is by no means a bad play...unless you are looking at fundamentals. Basically you need to show button that he can't just go around isolating every time MP3 raises and this IMO is like the PERFECT hand to do it with. It looks kind of like you are getting involved in the idiocy if BT is a pretty good player...if he is a poster on here he probably knows what you are doing. But now you are 1) teaching button a lesson and 2) doing it in such a way that you kind of advertise negatively about yourself. I probably wouldn't have had the cajones to do this but I really like it Harv.

Fundamentally this is a terrible play e.g. seeing a capped flop with A8o.

[Bob T.]

I wouldn't do this. I think that you can wait for a hand where you have a bigger edge. The pots are likely to be big at this table, so you can fold a lot of blinds in order to wait for the big hand, instead of wandering in to the mess.

I might threebet the maniac here, but I don't like capping it with two players in, even with their expanded ranges, it just doesn't feel like you have much of an edge if any.

Now, someone could pokerstove this and convince me that I'm wrong, but it is one of those situations that just feels a little too gambly for me, especially since we are probably going to a showdown, and I don't like our hand that much for a showdown.

[SeaEagle]

Man, I really don't like this.

I don't mind the play so much; I just don't like it out of the BB. You're going to have a really hard time figuring out what to do after the flop since you have conflicting goals of wanting to get to showdown and wanting to bet at your opponents. Even in this circumstance, A8o isn't all that good of a hand and I think you'll have a hard time making it pay off out of position.

Given your reads, I shouldn't take long to get a chance to make this play in the CO or button. Even with the extra sb cost, I think you're going to have a better EV with position - acting after your opponents will give you a much better idea which of your two goals to chase.

[Man of Means]

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But now you are 1) teaching button a lesson and 2) doing it in such a way that you kind of advertise negatively about yourself.

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I like this aspect of it. IF you get to show it down, others will think "he's joined in the insanity" and BTN may think twice about 3-betting ace-rag & micropairs. IF you show it down. Otherwise it looks like you got pushed around again.

[Jiggymike]

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But now you are 1) teaching button a lesson and 2) doing it in such a way that you kind of advertise negatively about yourself.

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I like this aspect of it. IF you get to show it down, others will think "he's joined in the insanity" and BTN may think twice about 3-betting ace-rag & micropairs. IF you show it down. Otherwise it looks like you got pushed around again.

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I thought the value of the play in +EV was quite thin (if at all) but that Harv made the play pretty much solely for these purposes. Doing it with something like 62o would just be idiotic, A8o is good enough to win some of the time and just a great hand to show down in the situation (true, if you can get there).

[Lamarius_dsp]

I like this...Although it does take huge set of balls to do this. With maniac raising a LARGE range of hands you probably have a good edge on him. Button probably thinks he can isolate and use his position to beat maniac out of the pot so his range may have loosened up significantly, espescially from late position. But what is your strategy from here?
I'm assuming a large portion of your decision rests on the fact that you are making such a strong raise out of position for deception representing a very strong hand.
so do you lead out on the flop regardless? I think I would bet and hope the board hit neither. or maybe button got a piece and your deception gives you a significant fold equity on him. the only thing you should be worried about is if Maniac hits any and you go unimproved, you hit your ace and button has a bigger one, or button has a PP.

I believe, given your image, given previous action and events, this is a good play. Unfortunately If you don't hit or can't pull it down on the flop, you will be in for some very tough decisions

[justJeff]

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Using SSHE thinking

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this hand/poster/situation is way past that

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I fully understand what the poster may be trying to do, and maybe it truly is genius at work and will work out, certainly a ballsy move. I can't reall believe your statement that the poster is "way past" playing something like SSHE strategy or he probably wouldn't be playing in a 3/6 game.

[Bluffoon]

Agreed to wait for a better situation. One of the hardest things for me is to sit and fold while some idiot is giving money away and the whole table is on tilt but I think that is what has to be done here.

Rather than go on tilt myself I would rather be patient and realize that if I do pick up a hand or two I am going to get paid off huge.

This is not to say that you need to wait for premium hands but at least solidly playable hands and/or a better chance to isolate in position, especially if the preflop action is aggressive.

[James.]

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I just don't like it out of the BB.

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my thoughts at first as well. i liked it on the button or some other LP. BUT it shows a tremendous amount of strength cold-capping out of the BB. everyone but the maniac should notice this and possibly fold incorrectly. it also sends a message about future hands, and should gain crazy action if he shows it down. in a vacuum it sucks, but we ain't playing poker in a vacuum.

[Harv72b]

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You're going to have a really hard time figuring out what to do after the flop since you have conflicting goals of wanting to get to showdown and wanting to bet at your opponents.

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What to do after the flop is remarkably easy: make a continuation bet & see what happens.

I know that MP3 is going to call with any 2 cards. If he raises, he probably has a pair of some sort, but he could be on a draw as well.

The real qualifier is what Button does. If he calls the flop continuation bet, he probably has me beat and I have to decide whether or not it's worth firing a second barrel. Probably not. If he raises the flop continuation bet, or coldcalls my bet + a raise from MP3, then he's got me crushed and I can exit stage left (note that I'm including a possible strong draw as having me "crushed"). If the action goes bet/raise/3bet and I'm still sitting there with ace high, then I can take a few seconds to ponder calling with my AK or TT or whatever I feel like representing, eventually fold, and the type a "nh" or something after the showdown.

I just want to stress...I am not committing myself to a showdown in this pot, unless I have improved and it is heads up against MP3. If Button sees the turn and I don't improve, then I'm not usually putting any more bets in. If it's heads up vs. MP3 and he has not raised or there is an obvious missed draw showing, I will often check/call the river for value with my ace high.