Question- when do you lead into a raiser?

[carnivalhobo]

[ QUOTE ]
Yes, that's what I'm saying. More so with a hand like AQ or AK, where he flop top pair A-kicker.

[/ QUOTE ]

so why ever b/3b a draw? shouldnt we always c/r and lead turn since people fold TPTK to this move every time?

[Cue-Ball 66]

b/3b a draw so your hand's disguised when you have a monster, and plus you usually b/3b monster draws where you're ahead or slightly behind anyway.

I'm not saying people fold TPTK to c/r cont turn every time, I'm just saying this line makes the pot smaller and easier to get away from.

P.S. I don't hate the c/r cont line, it's not bad at all. Just stating the pros and cons of the b/3b.

[mikechops]

[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
I usually do it if I have a monster and the flop likely hit him. Set or two-pair on an A high board or I flopped a broadway straight ect. I'm looking to get raised here.

If I think the flop missed him and it missed me too, I'll sometimes do it.

[/ QUOTE ]

In situation one, wont he bet his monster as well as the off chance he has air, you get a bet from that. In the second example, why not let his cbet and then steal that too?

[/ QUOTE ]

Is a TPGK on an A high board a monster? I guess what I'm trying to do is represent a weak Ace in a kind of "I got an ace and I don't think you have one Mr PFRer" way. I think leading induces a raise here and doesn't scare a lone Ace nearly as much as a c/r.

For the 2nd example (raggy board, I missed and think he did too) I don't like a c/r. When it works you make more but if you run into an overpair, it can cost up to 4 times as much. I'm really looking to steal the pot cheaply for maybe 1/2- 2/3 PSB

[LearnedfromTV]

I lead a lot of stuff into a preflop raiser. Sets and good draws intending to bet 3 bet; mediocre made hands especially if I think the raiser's reaction to a lead will be easy to read; also bluffs or weak draws on occasion, including low pocket pairs that miss and gutshots. Especially when the raiser has trash, he owns you when you call w/ 22, lead every set and check-fold every other time.

Majority of the time I lead it's intending to threebet with a big hand. But I try to throw in non-monsters/give up if played with hands often enough that most people either make a mistake by raising the big hands too much or folding to the weak hands.

I checkraise sometimes too with all those hands, again mostly big hands and draws, but other hands often enough for balance.

In general I try to checkraise or lead often enough to protect my checks so I don't get cbet to death, but I think defending against the cbet OOP is pretty tough and I don't really do it well.

I don't think lead or c-raise is unqualifiably "better." It depends on what your opponent does too much of, how he perceives your tendencies, etc.

[orange]

Leading into the PFR is okay (both w. or without a hand) and should be a part of balancing your play for when you DO lead w. sets.

I think leading into solid/in line players occassionally is good. It gets harder when they bluff raise you more frequently.

[UCLAseetoK]

I lead a lot HU vs pfr's when I have a mediocre hand (vs the pfr's possible range) and I want to take it down on the flop. c/c with those type of hands sucks.

[jjpregler]

It depends on relative position and whether the player typically makes a c-bet or if he checks. If he is going to check, then I want to make sure that I bet. If I am in good relative position, there are more players in the pot, and he will make a c-bet, I will check and let him hang himself ( and maybe a caller in a multi way pot), then I base my raise on the texture of the board. If you lead out, you may lose this money.

The times I will lead out are when I have a mediocre hand to see where I am at. This will work unless the PF raiser will raise on a bluff too often. If most of the times he play he raises only when he has a hand, folds when he misses or calls his mediocre or draws, then it is good to bet out.

[bilbo-san]

One spot where I see a ton of players check, but you should almost always lead, is when you flop a set on a drawy flop, and the pot is 3 or 4-way. ESPECIALLY 4-way.

The PFR just is very often not going to bet unless he has a good draw or a good pair here so checking is terrible because it sucks to have a flop like that get checked around.

[ValarMorghulis]

When do I lead into the preflop raiser on the flop?
Generally never. People generally cbet, so I want his cbet money in the pot before I making a play for the pot. So I'll c/r or c/c with any hand I want to continue with. The exception is if I think the preflop raiser won't cbet e.g. super passive player or multiway pot.

[bhudson]

A lot of you are thinking about donking when you have a strong hand. That's fine as far as it goes, but you need to donk with ATC too. There are lots of players who will auto-cbet and double barrel with air but fold if donked into. You should frequently donk into these players with a hand that missed the flop, but has a chance to improve (OC on up) or with mediocre hands that can't stand a second barrel. Then donk your monsters against aggressive players, or in multiway pots where the majority of players are too stupid to realize leading into multiple players is a huge sign of strength, or when you have been donking a lot so they honestly can't tell.