Is there really such thing as a "self-less" act? - Page 4

Roy Munson · #31 09-15-2006, 05:55 AM

Many Buddhists would claim that one would build good karma in this scenario.

Brainwalter · #32 09-15-2006, 07:31 AM

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Example: although it is not true (as your example shows), neoclassical economists have often assumed for simplicity/approximation in models that human beings do not care about the welfare of other human beings i.e. they don't get a beneficially feeling from helping others, nor do they get an intrinsic benefit or get harmed from harming others.

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Link source pls.

GuyOnTilt · #33 09-15-2006, 08:34 AM

I got in a big discussion once with some friends over dinner about this. We were specifically talking about the choice to have a child, and somehow the concept of selfishness got thrown in there. I played the role of cynic versus the rest of the table and contended that choosing to have a child was definitely a selfish act, while acknowledging that being rooted in selfishness does not necessarily a bad thing make. That was about the time they all jumped down my throat loudly and simultaneously.

I'm smart enough to know I can't speak for humanity. But as for myself... I'm a pretty nice guy. I'm caring to others, I try at every reasonable opportunity to look out for strangers and friends before myself, and I give generously. But if I'm truly honest with myself, the most basic motive behind virtually every decision I make - from choosing what clothes I wear and what food I eat, to buying a gift for a friend, taking a homeless kid out to coffee, or giving an anonymous check to a family I know is struggling - boils down to one thing: Because I like the way it makes me feel. And if it's not that, it's something very similar and equally self-serving. I've come to accept that though; I'm okay with it.

GoT

NSchandler · #34 09-15-2006, 09:16 AM

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Example: although it is not true (as your example shows), neoclassical economists have often assumed for simplicity/approximation in models that human beings do not care about the welfare of other human beings i.e. they don't get a beneficially feeling from helping others, nor do they get an intrinsic benefit or get harmed from harming others. Another way of saying this is that something is self-interested if it only cares about itself.

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Yeah that's not really true.

punkass · #35 09-15-2006, 09:18 AM

You should let a bee sting you, just out of the goodness of your heart. NOT SELFISH AT ALL!!

xxThe_Lebowskixx · #36 09-15-2006, 10:24 AM

[ QUOTE ]
I got in a big discussion once with some friends over dinner about this. We were specifically talking about the choice to have a child, and somehow the concept of selfishness got thrown in there. I played the role of cynic versus the rest of the table and contended that choosing to have a child was definitely a selfish act, while acknowledging that being rooted in selfishness does not necessarily a bad thing make. That was about the time they all jumped down my throat loudly and simultaneously.

I'm smart enough to know I can't speak for humanity. But as for myself... I'm a pretty nice guy. I'm caring to others, I try at every reasonable opportunity to look out for strangers and friends before myself, and I give generously. But if I'm truly honest with myself, the most basic motive behind virtually every decision I make - from choosing what clothes I wear and what food I eat, to buying a gift for a friend, taking a homeless kid out to coffee, or giving an anonymous check to a family I know is struggling - boils down to one thing: Because I like the way it makes me feel. And if it's not that, it's something very similar and equally self-serving. I've come to accept that though; I'm okay with it.

GoT

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man, you sound boring.

bocablkr · #37 09-15-2006, 10:38 AM

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Think about it. When you give someone something with the intention of comitting a selfless act, you are in turn recieiving the gratification of the fact that you gave what you did to that particular person. Now this could be an act, a material posession, advice, etc. We all have reasons for helping people, and usually it is along the lines of "it makes me feel good". Now it would be going to far to say Mother Theresea was selfish because she recieved the gratification of knowing she helped many a soul. But besides by accdient, is it really possible to do a selfless act? If someone can give me an example, i'd be very curious to hear it.

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You are wrong - there are selfless acts. The definition is 'motivated by no concern for oneself'. Because you end of feeling good does not mean that was the motive for your initial act. It is simply a by product or end result not the motive [img]/images/graemlins/cool.gif[/img]

PokerBot123 · #38 09-15-2006, 10:42 AM

The difference between selfish and selfless is your intention not your action. Therefor you can never find examples of a totally selfless act.

I'd still argue that totally selfless actions excist, but they are not very likly to be noticed by anyone. Catch 22.

MaxPower · #39 09-15-2006, 10:46 AM

There is a whole debate in psychology about this. There is one psychologist whose name I cannot remember who had been trying to prove that there is such a thing as true altruism. I think he argues that true altriusm is motivated by empathy and is really selfless. However, it is also possible that an empathic reaction is unpleasant and that the real motivation for helping the other person is to reduce that unpleasantness.

I don't really believe that any act is selfless, but I still admire those who help others, since it is very easy not to.

bocablkr · #40 09-15-2006, 10:57 AM

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There is a whole debate in psychology about this. There is one psychologist whose name I cannot remember who had been trying to prove that there is such a thing as true altruism. I think he argues that true altriusm is motivated by empathy and is really selfless. However, it is also possible that an empathic reaction is unpleasant and that the real motivation for helping the other person is to reduce that unpleasantness.

I don't really believe that any act is selfless, but I still admire those who help others, since it is very easy not to.

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A while back, I was snorkeling in about 5 feet of water but had to hang on to a rock because of the strong current. I look up and see a small child floating by out to sea. I immediately let go of the rock and grab her and struggle back to the rock with her. Several people had seen her but did nothing. Needless to say her parents were ecstatic. You claim I reacted in a split second based on empathy, altruism or some personal gratification - hogwash.